Jump to content

  •  


The 10th Annual Hot Pepper Awards Winners Announced!

Photo

Fermenting Peppers 101


  • Please log in to reply
954 replies to this topic

#41 2p0p

2p0p

    Mild

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 17 posts
  • Location:Brisbane

Posted 05 August 2011 - 05:53 AM

I'd love to hear more about your sauces. Could you give a brief step by step? One of my main reasons for wanting to make a fermented sauce is so I can process and store my harvests efficiently and at a convenient pace. If I could simply blend, brine, ferment and store outside of the fridge it would be ideal.

1 Keep anaerobic...keep solids submerged and use an airlock.
2 20c is the best temperature for fermentation.
3 inoculation with live bacteria is not necessary but is a good and worthwhile insurance policy.
4 After full fermentation fill bottles to the top. Make airtight seals.
5 Watch and wonder...be interested in the process.
6 Read E.R.Farnworth on the subject.

This is what it boils down to for me...it is an incredibly complex interplay of succession amongst organisms that are so compatible with the human body.
Paradoxically it has been around for thousands of years as the primary preservation method of a lot of so called simple but undeniably healthy cultures/peoples.
Generally used as condiments...don't plan on eating truckloads of fermented foods...one can overdo it a break out in rashes.

"I can process and store my harvests efficiently and at a convenient pace"...yes you can, my thoughts exactly.

#1A Guest

Guest

  • Guest
  • Pip
  • 1 post

#42 RocketMan

RocketMan

    On Fire!

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,416 posts
  • aka:RM
  • Location:Titusville, FL
  • (x2)

Posted 05 August 2011 - 06:37 AM

ok, I've seen Kefir in the grocery store but never picked it up and looked at it closely but I have noted that all of the ones they carry is flavored. Is it like yogurt or different? is it a better source of Probiotics than yogurt? I have a daughter that eats the Activia everyday for her stomach would the Kefir be better source than that for what she's getting from it?

Thanks,
RM
Answering The Call For Fire!  If you can't stand the Heat, don't tickle the Dragon!

#43 Chili Monsta

Chili Monsta

    Hot

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 741 posts
  • Location:Kentucky

Posted 05 August 2011 - 07:23 AM

RM, you should check out "Dom's Kefir FAQ's" at the following site.
Its all about Kefir.
I used "Yogurmet" brand kefir starter for the first time, in a batch of Kim Chi last week and it was bubbling away in about 9 or 10 hours.
IMO its very easy to use...is pretty much fool proof and I couldn't detect any difference in the flavor from previous batches where I have used whey and/or salt.

http://users.sa.char.../kefir-faq.html

#44 ZanderSpice

ZanderSpice

    Hot

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 935 posts
  • Location:Southern California

Posted 05 August 2011 - 12:20 PM

Thanks 2p0p,

Could you clarify step 4 a bit? I'm using canning jars for fermentation (w/ airlock) and storage. Would that mean that I take my mash and transfer it to a smaller jar? Perhaps combine different mashes to fill up a jar or jars? Is this full fermentation usually complete after 7-10 days? Then I am safe to store these tightly sealed jars in a dark place until ready to consume?

Searching the net for E.R.Farnworth right now...

Thanks.

#45 RocketMan

RocketMan

    On Fire!

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,416 posts
  • aka:RM
  • Location:Titusville, FL
  • (x2)

Posted 05 August 2011 - 03:35 PM

Ok, I'm intrigued and I'm going to have to try making a raw sauce. I'm going out this weekend to look for a good supply of pepper. I'm hoping to find some good looking Carabian Reds or Scotch Bonnets. Lately my usual supply place has only had some Fresno's that looked any good but hey, what should I expect of a Chain store.
Answering The Call For Fire!  If you can't stand the Heat, don't tickle the Dragon!

#46 2p0p

2p0p

    Mild

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 17 posts
  • Location:Brisbane

Posted 06 August 2011 - 11:46 PM

Dom is very knowledgeable about Kefir...he has been working with it a lot for over 30 years.

I fill my bottles to the top because i don't want any air in there...that way they should store well...but primary fermentation must be pretty complete-
otherwise over long storage they may blow. Take a sample and blend it up very fine..put in a jar with lid...if it bubbles up again in the next few days (depending on temp.)it is not fully fermented.. Fermentation times vary...it depends on the temp. and the particle size and the nature of each ingredient...industry doesn't like raw fermentation because it is a volatile and variable artisan process that still challenges modern mans understanding of other realms of symbiotic life and how we can reconnect to a time before Pasteur and his fellow scientists said basically "kill the lot, sterilize "...the ancients kept things for years , brand Tabasco is fermented for 3 years, we leave our current raw chili sauces on a kitchen bench or cupboard all through the summer with out a problem...i'm not saying there won't be problems and a coolish 12-15c spot for storage or fridge is certainly better than a hot environment...end of summer to autumn/fall is the logical time to do most of your bottling...working with the seasons ... eating live foods makes sense to me and is worth the learning curve.

#47 Nor Cal Heat

Nor Cal Heat

    Mild

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 63 posts
  • Location:Nothern CA

Posted 23 September 2011 - 09:52 AM

Do you need to use an air lock? Is there an alternative? I do not have one

#48 Chili Monsta

Chili Monsta

    Hot

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 741 posts
  • Location:Kentucky

Posted 23 September 2011 - 11:32 AM

Do you need to use an air lock? Is there an alternative? I do not have one


You might want to check out some of these links and review the various techniques and recipes.

Helpful Links.

Fermenting pickles and peppers
http://www.grist.org...ing-made-simple

Steps to fermenting peppers
http://www.nathaliel...uce-raw-tabasco

Several good recipes and instructions
http://nourishedkitc...i-sauce-recipe/

Get Cultured (Nourished Kitchen free e-book)
http://issuu.com/nou...howFlipBtn=true

Bob Hurt Hab Mash
http://www.scribd.co...h-and-Hot-Sauce

Nice fermentation blog
http://okanagandaily...asco-sauce.html

Q/A about mash process
http://en.allexperts...pper-mash-1.htm

Kitchen Gardens blog/ 5 step HS recipe
http://kitchengarden...r-own-hot-sauce

#49 rmardis

rmardis

    Heating Up

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 105 posts
  • Location:KY

Posted 23 September 2011 - 11:33 AM

Do you need to use an air lock? Is there an alternative? I do not have one



Make sure that you have whatever it is you are fermenting under your liquid. If you are planning to use a lid, make sure if it is air tight, to open it to relaese the pressure.... So you do not need an air lock, it just seems to make things a bit easier. However, i seem to always get yeast that forms about 50% of the time.
"He is not a fool to give the things which he cannot keep to gain the things which he cannot lose"

#50 rmardis

rmardis

    Heating Up

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 105 posts
  • Location:KY

Posted 23 September 2011 - 11:37 AM

You might want to check out some of these links and review the various techniques and recipes.

Helpful Links.

Fermenting pickles and peppers
http://www.grist.org...ing-made-simple

Steps to fermenting peppers
http://www.nathaliel...uce-raw-tabasco

Several good recipes and instructions
http://nourishedkitc...i-sauce-recipe/

Get Cultured (Nourished Kitchen free e-book)
http://issuu.com/nou...howFlipBtn=true

Bob Hurt Hab Mash
http://www.scribd.co...h-and-Hot-Sauce

Nice fermentation blog
http://okanagandaily...asco-sauce.html

Q/A about mash process
http://en.allexperts...pper-mash-1.htm

Kitchen Gardens blog/ 5 step HS recipe
http://kitchengarden...r-own-hot-sauce



Seems like we both read that at the same time CM. If i knew that i would not have answered oh wise master of the ferments :cool:

by the way CM. My kim chi is still out. Not where i want the taste at yet. Should not be long until i put it in the fridge.
"He is not a fool to give the things which he cannot keep to gain the things which he cannot lose"

#51 finitejest

finitejest

    Heating Up

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 128 posts
  • Location:Winnipeg, MB

Posted 24 September 2011 - 06:16 PM

Great thread all. I bought a bunch of peppers at the farmer's market today and then picked up a one gallon jar and airlock.

I don't have enough peppers to fill the jar. Is there any problem with only using a portion of the jar? Also, I have wine yeast. Will that work as a starter, or should I get something else? It's saccharomyces cerevisiae. Any thought are appreciated!

#52 Chili Monsta

Chili Monsta

    Hot

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 741 posts
  • Location:Kentucky

Posted 25 September 2011 - 06:04 AM

Great thread all. I bought a bunch of peppers at the farmer's market today and then picked up a one gallon jar and airlock.

I don't have enough peppers to fill the jar. Is there any problem with only using a portion of the jar? Also, I have wine yeast. Will that work as a starter, or should I get something else? It's saccharomyces cerevisiae. Any thought are appreciated!

Greetings finitejest

Be aware that the use of a starter is purely optional.
Successful ferments will occur without adding a starter,because the "friendly" bacteria is present on the air and on the vegetables, but it may take a little longer to begin "working".
I'd suggest using a starter that contains a lactobacillus bacteria, or one of the other "friendly" bacteria used to ferment dairy products(kefir,yogurt,cottage cheese).
I regularly use whey that I have harvested from yogurt, and I recently purchased a freeze dried yogurt/kefir starter and had very good results also.
Lactobacilli bacteria are able to neuteralize unfriendly bacteria because as they consume the sugars/starches, the process produces lactic acid and carbon dioxide that alters the fermentation environment, making it unsuitable for the unfriendly bacteria.
In other words, lactobacilli do not destroy the unfriendly bacteria; they destroy their home, forcing them to leave.

As for the extra space in your ferment container,I normally try to choose a container size that will allow only a couple inches to remain.
The reason being is that the "unfriendly" bacteria require oxygen to survive.The added space allows for more oxygen in the container that must be displaced by the CO2.
The longer there is oxygen present inside the ferment container the greater the potential for development of unwanted bacteria and/or yeast.
Note:
If your air lock lid is a standard size, it should interchange with a regular pint or quart size mason jar.

Good luck with your fermenting project this weekend...enjoy the process
CM

Edited by Chili Monsta, 25 September 2011 - 06:15 AM.


#53 Nor Cal Heat

Nor Cal Heat

    Mild

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 63 posts
  • Location:Nothern CA

Posted 25 September 2011 - 01:12 PM

In an attempt to ferment the mash and I added the vinegar too soon. Will this halt fermentation?

#54 RocketMan

RocketMan

    On Fire!

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,416 posts
  • aka:RM
  • Location:Titusville, FL
  • (x2)

Posted 25 September 2011 - 07:44 PM

As I have never added vinegar to any of mine I cant really say for certain but I have seen where others have done it with no problems. So.... I think you'll be fine. Unless of course you added like 5 cups. :eek:

Cheers,
RM :cool:
Answering The Call For Fire!  If you can't stand the Heat, don't tickle the Dragon!

#55 Nor Cal Heat

Nor Cal Heat

    Mild

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 63 posts
  • Location:Nothern CA

Posted 25 September 2011 - 08:29 PM

1\4c per 1lb peppers. Will keep an eye on it see what happens

#56 rmardis

rmardis

    Heating Up

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 105 posts
  • Location:KY

Posted 28 September 2011 - 12:14 AM

Why in the world does that yeast appear in 95% of my ferments with peppers? It is driving me crazy :crazy:
"He is not a fool to give the things which he cannot keep to gain the things which he cannot lose"

#57 Chili Monsta

Chili Monsta

    Hot

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 741 posts
  • Location:Kentucky

Posted 28 September 2011 - 09:43 AM

Why in the world does that yeast appear in 95% of my ferments with peppers? It is driving me crazy :crazy:

What ingredients & amounts did you use...has the container been opened since first sealed?
I'd probably just open the container...remove as much of the yeast growth as is possible, and stir in enough additional brine to cover the solids.....Reseal and let it continue fermenting.

#58 rmardis

rmardis

    Heating Up

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 105 posts
  • Location:KY

Posted 28 September 2011 - 12:29 PM

What ingredients & amounts did you use...has the container been opened since first sealed?
I'd probably just open the container...remove as much of the yeast growth as is possible, and stir in enough additional brine to cover the solids.....Reseal and let it continue fermenting.



A few dry mixes with just hot peppers and added 6% salt. Some i used a brine about 3.5%. some i have added just peppers, some i have added other veggies. This last one, yesterday, i did about 900g of orange habs and i only added about 3% salt, but i added about 1/2c of whey from my kefir. I would think since i am using a good starter, i can go less on my salt. whats your thoughts? Another thing, i have left the yeast in my jars. I did not want to open them until it was completed. I was trying not to let any O in the jars. Do you think i should scrap it out? AND, yep another one. When doing a dry ferment how much salt do you use?
"He is not a fool to give the things which he cannot keep to gain the things which he cannot lose"

#59 Chili Monsta

Chili Monsta

    Hot

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 741 posts
  • Location:Kentucky

Posted 29 September 2011 - 01:26 PM

rmardis,
Oh no,.... don't throw any of them out based upon the yeast growth.
The yeast doesn't indicate there is any spoilage.Its a common occurrence.
Just remove it as best you can and make sure there is enough brine to keep the ingredients submerged. If not add some more brine.
The growth will only occur on the surface where it has, or has had, access to oxygen.
The peppers themselves are under the anaerobic protection of the brine.

In the past I have experienced the same growth several times...often in batches that contained identical ingredients as others that never had any growth at all.
Its ugly.... but harmless....if its removed from the ferment, the end result is unaffected.

Be aware, that it's a fine line to balance Mother Nature's rules by reducing the amount of salt when using a starter, especially with the dry brine method.
The dry brine method depends upon salt drawing out the natural juices of the vegetables used, but at the same time the salt also inhibits the starter's activity that results in the creation of acid.
Some veggies(like cabbage)are considered to be "self brining" because of their abundance of natural juices, and are extremely easy to ferment successfully using much less salt and without any kind of starter.
Conversely, some veggies(like some pepper varieties)contain much less juice, making a successful dry brine even more difficult. Plus, peppers have all that area inside the pod that can hide blemishes or defects inside the fruit that become part of the fermented mash.
(Note: I've often included a couple leaves of cabbage in whatever I'm fermenting, just for the self brining qualities it brings)

Case in point:
On Saturday I did a small dry brine batch(approx.-200 grams) of a ghost pepper mash. I added 5% salt by weight,1/2 tsp kefir starter,and 1 TBS sorghum.
As of this morning there is still no evidence of airlock activity, and it appears to have some yeast forming on top.
I have used the same proportions many times previously and had successful ferments without a hitch, but those ferments weren't same variety of pepper.
I consider this kind of symptom as a reminder that lacto fermenting is a balancing act of variables. There are times some of the variables are unknown until there's an indicator of some kind, which requires some sort of action or "tweek" to regain the balance.
Don't get discouraged,enjoy the process and then the end results.

Edited by Chili Monsta, 29 September 2011 - 01:27 PM.


#60 rmardis

rmardis

    Heating Up

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 105 posts
  • Location:KY

Posted 29 September 2011 - 11:51 PM

Thanks man,that helps out a lot. One thing i started doing is making sure i have some good sugar carbs in there. Still tweaking things a bit to see what works best and taste the best.
Thanks Bro
"He is not a fool to give the things which he cannot keep to gain the things which he cannot lose"




6 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 6 guests