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fermenting Fermenting with Vinegar
- Thread starter einterhot
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Hi, einterhot
First off
to the THP.
Your reaserch into this site will give you lots of tips and hints into making a sauce like you describe. Its actually very simple to accomplish just takes time for the fermentation process and aging. If you patient your efforts will be rewarded with some great tasting sauces.
There are many different methods that people use to ferment thier sauces/veggies. Some leave whole, some rough chop, some puree. Its all up to the user on how they want to tackle it. To give you a very simple method for fermenting, its basically, food, water, salt, bacteria, and time. However, you need to do your reaserch and make sure you know you have "all your bases covered" before diving into something that is foreign to you. Here is a good starting point
http://thehotpepper.com/topic/23146-fermenting-peppers-101/?hl=%2Bfermenting+%2B101
Spend some time in the hot sauce topics and you will see many ferments that others have done and learn from them too. The great thing about THP is whenever you are stuck, have questions, or concerns you can post em up and we'll get them answered for ya no problem. Lots of good info here just need to take the time to find it, or ask.
When you get rolling post up your concoctions, we like looking at pictures!
Again, welcome and good luck!
First off
to the THP.Your reaserch into this site will give you lots of tips and hints into making a sauce like you describe. Its actually very simple to accomplish just takes time for the fermentation process and aging. If you patient your efforts will be rewarded with some great tasting sauces.
There are many different methods that people use to ferment thier sauces/veggies. Some leave whole, some rough chop, some puree. Its all up to the user on how they want to tackle it. To give you a very simple method for fermenting, its basically, food, water, salt, bacteria, and time. However, you need to do your reaserch and make sure you know you have "all your bases covered" before diving into something that is foreign to you. Here is a good starting point
http://thehotpepper.com/topic/23146-fermenting-peppers-101/?hl=%2Bfermenting+%2B101
Spend some time in the hot sauce topics and you will see many ferments that others have done and learn from them too. The great thing about THP is whenever you are stuck, have questions, or concerns you can post em up and we'll get them answered for ya no problem. Lots of good info here just need to take the time to find it, or ask.
When you get rolling post up your concoctions, we like looking at pictures!
Again, welcome and good luck!
Greetings einterhot,juanitos said:
....and Lactic Acid is a naturally occurring result of vegetable fermentation.
Your preservation options are pretty much, one or the other...unless, this is, you want to use extremely high levels of just salt,...but not sure how healthy, or for that matter edible, your finished product would be.
beerbreath81's response is spot on....review the THP topic on fermenting 101, see what and how others have fermented, and don't be shy about asking questions.
CM
Your first post mentioned tomato paste.
The practices addressed in fermenting 101,while focusing heavily on peppers, can be applied to fermenting vegetables.
Many folks who ferment peppers, also ferment other vegetables, including tomatoes. I do so myself, and after fermentation is complete I puree into a sauce.
Fermentation is a preservation method, where an acid is produced by a string of lacto bacteria that consumes carbohydrates and expels the lactic acid as a bi-product...which lowers the pH and preserves the vegetables against the growth of harmful bacteria that causes spoilage.
The naturally occurring lacto bacteria (LAB)is present,to varying degrees,on all vegetables. And will grow and create lactic acid. Some vegetables(like cabbages) have such an abundance of LAB on the leaves(as do many ground vegetables) that it ferments very easily.
The next time you are in the market, go check out a bag of coleslaw mix in the produce department that is near its expiration date. Take a big whiff.....that sour smell is the LAB doing its thing making lactic acid.
CM
The practices addressed in fermenting 101,while focusing heavily on peppers, can be applied to fermenting vegetables.
Many folks who ferment peppers, also ferment other vegetables, including tomatoes. I do so myself, and after fermentation is complete I puree into a sauce.
Fermentation is a preservation method, where an acid is produced by a string of lacto bacteria that consumes carbohydrates and expels the lactic acid as a bi-product...which lowers the pH and preserves the vegetables against the growth of harmful bacteria that causes spoilage.
The naturally occurring lacto bacteria (LAB)is present,to varying degrees,on all vegetables. And will grow and create lactic acid. Some vegetables(like cabbages) have such an abundance of LAB on the leaves(as do many ground vegetables) that it ferments very easily.
The next time you are in the market, go check out a bag of coleslaw mix in the produce department that is near its expiration date. Take a big whiff.....that sour smell is the LAB doing its thing making lactic acid.
CM
Its all realative my friend, all done the same way thats why I explaned it as "food, water, salt, bacteria, and time". You can great info on here or other places on the interwebs....(here we dig peppers). Still a little confused on what your actually tring to ferment, "liquid sauces from tomato paste"??? and your topic is "fermenting with vinegar" So what are you trying to make? Also remember that anything from a can will have sugars but ZERO latic acid bacteria due to the canning process. So if using canned stuffs you will need a starter, which you will find how to make in the thread listed above, or you can buy lactobacillus from a local homebrew shop to indroduce bacteria into your ferment.einterhot said:
Just so long as you are using foods that have fermentable sugars available its all done the same way.
Here is a link to a free ebook to that will introduce you to the basics of fermenting, lots of good info in here and even some recipes
http://www.culturesforhealth.com/free-ebooks-fermented-cultured-foods
Here's a link to a fermented salsa recipe.
I have used a similar recipe for several years (in fact I think I posted it on THP)...that I can puree into a sauce and use in my traditional red chili.
http://www.pickl-it.com/blog/743/antioxidant-rich-pickl-it-tomato-salsa/
CM
I have used a similar recipe for several years (in fact I think I posted it on THP)...that I can puree into a sauce and use in my traditional red chili.
http://www.pickl-it.com/blog/743/antioxidant-rich-pickl-it-tomato-salsa/
CM
I also plans to pack the sauces in glass bottles and hence looked at different methods of preservations and came across adding Vinegar for the purpose and as I read on came across Fermentation.... Main concern is how to remove Lactic Acid and other bi-products formed during the Process for making the Food ready to be packed?
I think you may be a bit confused. You dont want to remove the lactic acid. Your ultimate goal is to make a sauce which is shelf stable. This means you dont want nasties like botulism to grow in it. You can accomplish this by lowering the pH of the sauce...to below 4. You can do this by the addition of acetic acid, which is vinegar. Some people dont like the strong vinegar taste so as an alternative they do a fermentation. Your main bacteria that will do this for you is Lactobacillus acidophilus, it will eat the sugars in your mash (chopped peppers and whatever else you decide to ferment), and produce CO2 and Lactic acid. The Lactic acid is taking the place of the vinegar in the role of lowering the pH. If enough lactic acid was produced, then you have to add little if any vinegar...at that point you are just adding what little you want for flavor, and not for shelf stability purposes. In the end you use you fermented mash as the base for your sauce that you later cook up.
You really should read through the "Fermenting 101" thread. Its a long read, but full of important and useful info (proper techniques, addition of brines, things to look out for, etc).
You really should read through the "Fermenting 101" thread. Its a long read, but full of important and useful info (proper techniques, addition of brines, things to look out for, etc).