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seeds Newbie.... Half of my seedlings sprout and wither and die immediately... Oh No!!

Charx

Charx

Hi All.... first let me say that this forum is a wealth of information full of all kinds of friendly folks!!   I'm glad to be here (... this is my first post....).
 
I have been trying to start some Carolina Reapers, Butch-T Scorps, Naga Viper and some Ghost Peppers.  I am having a problem. About 50% of my seedlings sprout and put out the first two "leaves" which immediately wither and die.  I am using a Hydrofarm with a dome.   I keep the soil temperature between 80-85ºF.  My soil is 30% sand and 70% Miracle Grow Moisture Control posting soil.  I keep a 20 watt OttLite "plant growth" bulb on for 20hr per day. 
 
I have some pictures but I don't see a way to post them..... I'll show you what's going on if I can figure that out.
 
Thanks for any suggestions!
 
-- Charlie
 
 
Charx said:
Hi All.... first let me say that this forum is a wealth of information full of all kinds of friendly folks!!   I'm glad to be here (... this is my first post....).
 
I have been trying to start some Carolina Reapers, Butch-T Scorps, Naga Viper and some Ghost Peppers.  I am having a problem. About 50% of my seedlings sprout and put out the first two "leaves" which immediately wither and die.  I am using a Hydrofarm with a dome.   I keep the soil temperature between 80-85ºF.  My soil is 30% sand and 70% Miracle Grow Moisture Control posting soil.  I keep a 20 watt OttLite "plant growth" bulb on for 20hr per day. 
 
I have some pictures but I don't see a way to post them..... I'll show you what's going on if I can figure that out.
 Welcome and sorry to hear of your misfortune!! :( you need to use photobucket or anyone of the sites that store pic I used tinypics worked great just copy the url from your uploaded pics. Hope this helps no worries someone will help with your plants ask socalgardengal very knowledgeable! :)
Thanks for any suggestions!
 
-- Charlie
Click to expand...
 
could be damping off, or any number of root illnesses.
 
try baking your soil to 200+ degrees next time around just to eliminate this potential issue.
 
could also be excess salinity or urea toxicity.  did you add any fertilizer to this mix?  was this sand perhaps contaminated with salt or lye or some such thing?
 
could also be over heating them as mentioned above.
 
50% death rate suggests otherwise though.
 
really need pictures to go anywhere with this. if your seedlings are necking off at the stem, this is soil pathogen issue.
what do the roots look like?
 
when you pluck out a dead plant, are the roots garbage and slimey? is it exceptionally easy to pull out the stem, or do you feel the roots poping and snaping as you yank the sucker out.
 
search the sight for that how to post pictures thread and update this topic.
 
Good advice. Remove dome once most have sprouted. Check on sprouts every day for soil moisture. Do not overwater! Get better soil without chemical additives. Transplant when 2-3 true leaves appear. (My own opinion about using good soil.)

Glad to have you here. Best of luck in your garden.
 
Here are some pics.... this is my set up and here's what the seedlings are looking like:  
 
xqaolv.jpg

 
a4pfud.jpg

 
So far I am hearing: change soil from MG to.... (what do you recommend?)  and take off the dome..... the roots appear tight and healthy.
 
I have had about 2 out of 100 sprout like that. I would also like to know why that happens but that is not remove the dome time. I would only get them out of the dome when the leaves can soak up some rays those are not leaves yet.
 
the ONLY time ive had a seedling look like that was when im tearing off the stuck seed coatings and i rip off the cots.
 
that seriously looks like a 'fertilizer' burn to me.
 
what do the cots do when they open up? are they scorching? or the cots even forming at all?
 
Get better seeds or use peat, I don't understand why people use anything other them coco or peat moss for seed starting. You can use the soil with more organic material later on. Right now it just needs a medium that is sterile and easy to sprout from
 
well this potting soil DOES have some CRF added to the mix, but not insane amounts.
 
i do suspect you are getting "fertilizer burn", or more likely, ammonium or urea toxicity from the controlled release prills in this fertilizer. young plants are more susceptible to ammonium/urea toxicity than mature plants, sometimes much more susceptible.
 
why are some doing ok and others are not? could be down to the heterogeneity of these controlled release fertilizers.
the fertilizer is in these little bb's... its possible that your now dead plants had more of these bb's than the surviving plants. why dont you pull out the cells containing dead plants and count the number of fertilizer prills. 
 
then compare this with a cell containing a stil living plant. see whats going on... im genuinly curious on this one because folks almost ALWAYS mistak fert burn for something else. its rare to actually find a real fert burn case seing as how conservative folks are with chemical fertilizers.
 
id suggest that you put this mix aside for now, and look for a totally inert seedling mix. you want something without any fertilizers... something light and fluffy and free draining.
 
come back to this soil when you are potting these up.
 
Matthew_293 said:
Get better seeds or use peat, I don't understand why people use anything other them coco or peat moss for seed starting. You can use the soil with more organic material later on. Right now it just needs a medium that is sterile and easy to sprout from
Click to expand...
Again I am new to this but from what I have read peat isn't good for peppers due to high acidity. Coco is supposed to be better, correct me if im wrong please.
 
ammonium toxicity should result in dead root tips... and darkening of the roots themselves... you see any of this on your plants?

pepperBob said:
Again I am new to this but from what I have read peat isn't good for peppers due to high acidity. Coco is supposed to be better, correct me if im wrong please.
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pure peat is shitty for any seed mix. its hydrophobic and like you say, entirely too acidic.
 
i think hes referring to a peat based seedling mix like promix stuff. its a good choice but more expensive.
 
queequeg152 said:
the ONLY time ive had a seedling look like that was when im tearing off the stuck seed coatings and i rip off the cots.
 
that seriously looks like a 'fertilizer' burn to me.
 
what do the cots do when they open up? are they scorching? or the cots even forming at all?
Click to expand...
^^^that's my 1st guess. MG and germination trays not good bed fellows.
pepperBob said:
Again I am new to this but from what I have read peat isn't good for peppers due to high acidity. Coco is supposed to be better, correct me if im wrong please.
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IMO, peat is far superior to cocoa core. I would never use straight core for germination anyway, but then again I wont use core again for anything in any capacity. Peppers do good in an acidic media, mine are in a mixture when made into a slurry throws about 6.4pH with RO water.
 
n your case, I would worry more about high nitrogen than I would high acidity.
 
Let's keep it simple.
Ditch the MG/sand combo.
Go to Grange Co Op and buy Fox Farm Light Warrior seed starter.
Also, buy a bag of Fox Farm Happy Frog potting soil.
These are both very commonly used with great success.
When you first see signs of a sprout/hook, get it out of the dome, put it in a Solo cup with the Happy Frog, and get it under light.

Welcome, and check out the Pacific Northwest GLOG 2015.
 
Charx said:
So far I am hearing: change soil from MG to.... (what do you recommend?)  and take off the dome..... the roots appear tight and healthy.
Click to expand...
 
It's not the soil at all. People are giving you recommendations on what their preferred soil is, and there's nothing wrong with any of those recommendations. I've been sprouting and growing in MG for a while now with zero problems.
 
Some folks tend to prefer something that's more organic. Others don't mind the fertilizer mixed in the soil, like me. But the fact that you used MG has nothing to do with your plants shriveling and dying like that.
 
I'd be more willing to bet that you're cooking them in the dome. I've done it before. The thing that looks different about yours is that it's just the cots that are dying. When I cooked mine, the whole plant, stem and all laid down. Of course, I cooked mine in the sun, yours is just with a light. Could be just enough to damage the cots, but not the stem. Try sowing again and remove the dome after they sprout. I have 15 bucks that says the cots won't shrivel and die with the dome off.
 
Phil said:
 
It's not the soil at all. People are giving you recommendations on what their preferred soil is, and there's nothing wrong with any of those recommendations. I've been sprouting and growing in MG for a while now with zero problems.
 
Some folks tend to prefer something that's more organic. Others don't mind the fertilizer mixed in the soil, like me. But the fact that you used MG has nothing to do with your plants shriveling and dying like that.
 
I'd be more willing to bet that you're cooking them in the dome. I've done it before. The thing that looks different about yours is that it's just the cots that are dying. When I cooked mine, the whole plant, stem and all laid down. Of course, I cooked mine in the sun, yours is just with a light. Could be just enough to damage the cots, but not the stem. Try sowing again and remove the dome after they sprout. I have 15 bucks that says the cots won't shrivel and die with the dome off.
Click to expand...
 
do you germinate in miracle grow potting mix or the seed starting mix?
 
the potting mix DOES HAVE CRF ADDED... the seed mix does not.
 
queequeg152 said:
 
do you germinate in miracle grow potting mix or the seed starting mix?
 
the potting mix DOES HAVE CRF ADDED... the seed mix does not.
Click to expand...
 
Potting mix. Every year
I guess I should add that I don't buy fresh, hot mix every time. I do reuse my soil year to year. So that may be a factor. But I've never had an issue with the soil being too hot for seeds, even fresh out of the bag.
 
interesting. i wonder what the issue is.
 
i dont see how a single cfl could heat that dome such that its going to kill anything.
 
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