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2018 - The Farm


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#181 TrentL

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Posted 14 February 2018 - 10:34 PM

It's hard to get a sense of scale on the bigger grow room so I took pics every 8 feet.

 

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Got a wash sink in today as well as a safety shower / eye wash station plumbed in (in case some idiot gets a face full of Reaper powder or something)

 

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As I was leaving the horse stable looked creepy as shit in the fog; on the way home there was some spots with zero visibility. Damn near drove my truck in to a ditch. Couldn't see ANYTHING.

 

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#182 TrentL

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Posted 15 February 2018 - 01:40 AM

This is the list of no shows after 19 days. Some of these surprise me, I figured the annuums, especially, would have been quick to pop.  The habs and morugas I'm not so concerned about (I just crossed two off the no show list today; moruga butch T and 7-pot primo red, both sprouted at 18 days.)

 
7-pot chaguanas red
aji dulce red
Bhut jolokia Chocolate
Brown Moruga
Cayenne Long Red
Dorset Naga
Elephant Trunk
Habanero Orange
Habanero Red
Matay
Moruga Scorpion Red
Stuffing Cherry
Sugar Cane
Sweet French Bell
Tobago Seasoning
Turkish Sweet Ball
Aji Cereza
 
Hoping I get better results on the "big trays" of these.. would hate to lose qty 400-500 of a variety to no shows. There's no time for re-do's this year lol.
 
I've never grown some of these before, anyone have approx sprout times on any of the bold ones?
 

Edited by TrentL, 15 February 2018 - 01:43 AM.


#183 Chilidude

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Posted 15 February 2018 - 02:16 AM

Damn, you could film the sequel to a poltergeist movie inside that creepy place.



#184 Walchit

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Posted 15 February 2018 - 11:34 AM

Tobago seasoning was the first one that sprouted for me out of everything, I think they were seeds saved from a texashotpeppers pod

#185 TrentL

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Posted 15 February 2018 - 12:10 PM

Tobago seasoning was the first one that sprouted for me out of everything, I think they were seeds saved from a texashotpeppers pod

 

That's what I was wondering. The heat on those trays hit very hot early on, for a brief period of time. My wife kicked on the lights for me one morning when I started work and forgot, and for a few hours the 6 experimental trays were under full strength T5 HO's, on warming mats, with the overnight humidity domes on. The temp inside briefly (for a few hours) reached something in the neighborhood of 116-117F - at least that's what it showed when I found it over lunch.

 

What I'm conjecturing based on what has sprouted and what *hasn't* sprouted is seeds can withstand high temps briefly, but if they start germinating during that period of time they're toast. It's the only thing that would explain why fast-sprouters universally failed (the ones which should have sprouted on days 3-5 but didn't). Meanwhile seeds which are normally slow sprouting were fine - I'm seeing morugas and 7-pots sprout at day 18... and those seeds were subjected to the same rigors. Certain other varieties seemed wholly unaffected by the heat, and it might have even accelerated their sprouting significantly.

 

We know temperature and water saturation is a factor in germination speed and % for every vegetable and fruit plant out there. But what I didn't know was that different varieties of peppers would have such a diverse reaction to high temps. I figured "a pepper seed is a pepper seed is a...." Some peppers will withstand high germination temps and thrive under it, others will simply die out. I guess this makes sense considering some peppers are more heat/sunlight/drought resistant than others.

 

But irrelevant.. the data I'm collecting this year is mainly geared towards optimizing production next year. I need to figure out seeding order and time to transplant readiness per variety. When we start talking about scaling out it all gets a bit crazy. This year I'm doing the qty 2160 seedling grow in the basement in two batches, then moving the most viable over to the big grow room which can house 3,240 4" pots (plus a reserve of an additional 720 4" plants in the seedling room). 

*next* year, should things go well, and greenhouses are up, I'll be starting the seedlings out at the farm, on those big grow tables. I'll have room up there for two batches of 12,960 seedlings each (25,920 pepper plants total), which would then get transplanted out to greenhouses in to 4" pots. I need to have the germination data and time to transplant readiness timelines ironed 100% out by then in order to schedule labor.  Potting up close to 26k plants is going to be very time consuming. Suddenly a difference of "18 days to pot up readiness" or "32 days to pot up readiness" becomes a big deal. If I can get it so each variety is ready to go at a specific 1-2 day window then I can schedule seeding and know when they'll get transplanted and moved out to the greenhouses. The logistics puzzle needs to be crystal clear. Otherwise I'll have workers sitting there with nothing to do, or I'll have workers struggling to keep up with the sudden rush of "these need to go out NOW" ... 

 

This year none of the data I'm gathering is helpful in the least, but it will be next year. :)



#186 TrentL

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 02:10 AM

Potted up a few today to the 4" pots, as a test (figure if I kill 'em off I did something wrong lol; better to find out now than when I'm doing 'em in bulk!)

 

I used leftover sprouting test soil for them; Coir (100%) + 1/2 Cup worm castings per gal + 1/8 Cup Kelp Meal / gal + 1/16 cup azomite / gal

 
(My bone meal order got canceled / refunded so I have to track down more; this isn't the final potting soil mix just figured I'd use up what was left from sprouting for test transplant)
 
I should have got root pics - the roots were very well developed, healthy looking, well branched.
 

Big Sun Hab, Teken Dolmasi, Espanola, and Jalapeno Biker BIlly had their big days;

 

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Even with the abusive hot temperatures the first three trays are making some viable plants.

 

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The coir test tray is also doing well; I'm getting sprouts in the "dead zone" of the other trays. Germination rates are in the crapper on test trays 5/6 though (only diff there is pearlite / vermiculite was added)

 

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In the first production tray of MOA Scotch Bonnet, have 28 sprouts at day 8 mark, but *14* of them are seed heads. (100% coir)

 

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The yellow fatalli tray is doing real well, 34 sprouts at day 8, but 11 of them are seed heads (100% coir)

 

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The big sun habanero production test tray has 23 sprouts at day 8, 5 of which are seed heads (again, these were 100% coir)

 

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Edited by TrentL, 16 February 2018 - 02:13 AM.


#187 karoo

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 03:42 AM

Looking good. 

 

You mentioned the roots, this early stage is all about the roots. That's why I love the coco coir and bottom watering.


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#188 PtMD989

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 07:21 AM

Trent, what is the ratio / recipe for the H2O2 spray solution that you used for the fungus treatment?


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#189 TrentL

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 10:15 AM

Trent, what is the ratio / recipe for the H2O2 spray solution that you used for the fungus treatment?


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Wife just picks up the brown bottles in the store, I dump it in a spray bottle, and give it a light spraying. So far it's knocked out mold and fungus wherever I've used it without issue, and hasn't seemed to affect the plants at all. There's a slight fizzing as it does it's work. Not sure what the % is off the top of my head, whatever they sell for cleaning wounds in the personal hygiene section.

 

I don't go too crazy with it on the seedling trays though, just spot treat where the organics I've added to the sprouting soil show surface fuzzies. It's not happening on trays which are 100% coir only happening on the trays I added a bit of kelp meal to. 

 

I wouldn't use too much of it, unless it's a hail mary. I dumped entire quarts of it in to overwinters to save them from waterlogged fungus death, without problem, but it can alter the pH of soil, probably dangerously so, for sprouts. It's not so much the H2O2 Which does that but the additives they put in the bottle to keep it shelf stable.



#190 TrentL

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 10:31 AM

Looking good. 

 

You mentioned the roots, this early stage is all about the roots. That's why I love the coco coir and bottom watering.

 

Pearlite is proving to be bad news with coco coir. I need to run some more tests but it causes too much water retention, on top of what coco coir already can store. I'm getting crappy sprouting % and very, very slow growth on the trays with pearlite added in. 

 

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Trays 2, 3, 5, 6 had pearlite + vermiculite. Trays 3, 6 had a bit of azomite added in as well. 

 

A few plant deviation on a tray is no big deal but when you start to see percentages as high as this, there's something up. 

 

Straight coir is doing the best at sprouting. However, I don't yet have comparable data for true leaf development (need another 8 days before I have solid data there). Most of my coir seedlings are only a week old and I just saw the first plant giving off a true leaf bud last night. 

 

In a couple weeks I'll have good data comparing straight coir to coir + vermiculite which will isolate out the pearlite component. That differential test will give me a good idea to what extent pearlite is, as a negative additive for younger plants. I'm concerned that vermiculite is also a negative additive for younger plants, but this should give me some decent % differences. 

 

When I sprout the annuums in a couple weeks I'll set up test trays of similar species and compare germination rates and growth again, using different ratios of the additives. 



#191 TrentL

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 10:45 AM

Tray 7 and 15 started popping this morning. That's 7 pot primo (tray #7) and another tray of MOA scotch bonnets (#15)

 

Also I might have been wrong about Azomite having no effect. WAY wrong. 

 

Going to take a couple comparison pics... as soon as I track down a ruler.


Edited by TrentL, 16 February 2018 - 10:46 AM.


#192 TrentL

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 11:59 AM

Well maybe not. 

 

White bhut jolokia; seeded Jan 26;

 

100% peat

sprouted 2/5/2018 Showed true leaves 2/9

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70% peat 15% vermiculite 15% pearlite 

sprouted 2/6/2018, showed true leaves 2/9

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70% peat 15% vermiculite 15% pearlite, 1 tablespoon azomite

sprouted 2/7/2018, showed true leaves 2/10

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Those are about as close to each other in size as you could get. 

 

 

Others show some remarkable difference but this can be attributed to ranges in sprout dates

 

Fresno

 

Tray 1 sprouted last, 2/8/2018 at 13 days, Showed true leaves 2/12 (17 days)

 

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Tray 2 sprouted 2/6/2018 at 11 days, showed true leaves 2/10 (15 days)

 

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Tray 3 sprouted 2/4/2018 at 9 days, showed true leaves 2/7 (12 days)

 

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So the differences in plant development are directly in line with days from sprouting.

 

 

Biker billies are also following similar trajectories on growth between the three trays. All germinated the same day (2/1/2018) at the 6 day mark

 

Tray 1 was potted up yesterday, showed true leaves 2/8

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Tray 2, showed true leaves 2/7

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Tray 3, showed true leaves 2/8

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All similarly sized and developed, having already gone through a fork, and all are working on their third set of true leaves.

 

PDN's. Tray 2 didn't sprout, tray 1 and 3 sprouted 2/6 and 2/5 respectively (11 days, 10 days). Showed true leaves 2/11 and 2/10 respectively (16 days, 15 days)

 

Tray 1

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Tray 3

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Dulce Sol

I *do* see some major differences between trays here.

 

Tray 1 sprouted 2/2/2018 (7 days) true leaves showed up 2/7 (12 days)

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Tray 2 sprouted 2/3/2018 (8 days) true leaves showed up 2/7 (12 days)

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Tray 3 sprouted 2/1/2018 (6 days) true leaves showed up on 2/7 (12 days)

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Now the one in tray 3 really has shot up the last couple of days, so it's possible the other two will catch up since they sprouted 1 and 2 days later.

 

Anyway still doesn't appear Azomite had any effect. I thought it did based on the bigger growth in tray 3 on a couple of plants, but it failed to stand up to scrutiny. The differences were merely germination times, on those few which appeared noticeably bigger. Across the board the plants are all approximately the same - if you look at it from "days from emergence vs. size" rather than "days from seed vs. size"

 

 



#193 TrentL

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 12:24 PM

Today is the 3 week mark on those ^^ I figured I'd get a little photo heavy on a milestone day. :)

 



#194 TrentL

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 12:24 PM

dupe post removed


Edited by TrentL, 16 February 2018 - 12:24 PM.


#195 PtMD989

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 06:11 PM

They are looking good!


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#196 PtMD989

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 06:12 PM

They are looking good!


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#197 tctenten

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 06:42 PM

Glad to see your growing Biker Billy's. I will probably buy some of those from you.

#198 Devv

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 06:43 PM

Nice to see the scientific approach, this will be invaluable in the future.

 

Grow on!


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#199 TrentL

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Posted 17 February 2018 - 04:02 AM

THOSE ARE ROOKIE NUMBERS! YOU GOTTA PUMP UP THOSE NUMBERS!

 

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They are looking good!


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Thank you! They really need some nutrients though. They're getting a little long in the tooth to still be living in peat and coir without so much as a whiff of fertilizer.

 

Quite a few of those will get transplanted this weekend. FINALLY have water at the farm. Although.. it's high in sulfer. Damn well water there smells like rotten eggs!

 

Glad to see your growing Biker Billy's. I will probably buy some of those from you.

 

I'm sure I'll have a few extras!

 

Nice to see the scientific approach, this will be invaluable in the future.

 

Grow on!

 

It is TEDIOUS, my man. I am now spending about an hour and a half each night doing data entry. 

 

The mix trays are the worst. I'm using old Burpee Plant-O-Gram sheets to track what is going on there;

 

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For the full trays I just use a spiral notebook journal;

 

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Then I bring the papers upstairs, do the data entry in to excel;

 

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To get data on the full trays on a daily basis I insert new lines with that day's counts

 

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That gives me a pivot table of sprouts / day

 

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And I skew it based on # days to germination to get a comparison sheet since not all trays were planted at the same time. I can go back then and examine germination rates along the various experiments (e.g. scotch bonnets in straight coir vs. coir + vermiculite + kelp meal, or whatever)

 

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At that point I also have another pivot table which I can see my germination date ranges (separated by vendor when appropriate if I get the same seeds from different vendors; there's some surprising deviation; e.g. 7-pot primo reds from Buckeye are sprouting at 7-8 days while pepperlover's 7-pot primo reds are sprouting at *20* days; I'll bet you money those come out different phenos...)

 

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1st true leaves (and later, a transplants table) will give me some insight in to differences in plant development based on what amendments I add to the soil. My gut hunch is true leaf and transplant development will be faster with seeds sown in soil containing worm castings, kelp meal, ant other "very light" additives (not adding bone meal, blood meal, or other heavy duty stuff until I pot-up). But at a tradeoff - as I run the risk of mold / fungus from the organic additives destroying entire trays. The big question to answer, from a production standpoint, is it cost effective to more rapidly develop seedlings while they are still in the sprouting trays? Does it accelerate time to transplant? What risk do I incur of wiping out a batch of seedlings from potential nute burn? 

 

Lots of questions to answer. But this sheet, and the "transplants" one (which I still have to build) will tell me the answers to those.

 

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And of course it's all a moot point without knowing what is in what tray... so this sheet tracks the amendments added so I can reference it by tray #

 

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At the end of the grow I'll circle back around and integrate #/% Germinated / #/% transplanted in to this aggregate view

 

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Anyway, that's how I'm going about things this year. Whole reason is to get me a resource for NEXT year. THIS year, it's just a big pain in the ass. :)

 

At least having to do the daily ritual of counts and data entry, I don't run the risk of neglecting the plants. I'm looking at every cell, every day... so if something goes sideways (mold, dry cells) I'm able to handle it right away.

 



#200 Walchit

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Posted 17 February 2018 - 07:26 AM

You are really putting in the hours Trent! I can't wait to see those tables upstairs when they are full! Let alone the feild pics. You really are doing a service to the rest of us with your experiments too. I never document much of anything, if it wasn't for this site, i probably wouldn't even take so many pictures!




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