Why is everyone using a board with hundreds of the 1-3w chips when they could just buy a few of the 100w or 300W ones and literally flood their grow room with light. are they not as reliable or what?
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100-300w LED
- Thread starter Yumyumyellow
- Start date
http://www.satisled.com/Wholesale-100w300w-led_c22
He is probably talking about the spotlights that are a bunch of chips put together in 1 spotlight.
Watts means nothing except how fast your meter spins.Don't go by watts as far as thinking more watts is brighter.You might be dissapointed by buying a 300watt light that puts out 1000lm. where a newer tech 200watt one might put out 3000Lm.
Something to check out before you buy.
Do you want more Lumens or for your meter to spin faster while putting out less lumens?
I've been thinking about checking out a mix of cool , white and warm white LEDS to see how they do.
They are generally cheaper for higher Lumens but I tried just 1 colour of white 10mm LED and my plants did not like it.
I don't know what the K was or Lumens, they were given to me.
You would have to see what colour temp. the spots are to see if they are putting out the right wave lengths of light.
In general from 5000 - 6000k.Though some people use 3500k in fluorescent light...
Your link is a multi chip LED.
Each of the squares is an LED.
Watts means nothing except how fast your meter spins.Don't go by watts as far as thinking more watts is brighter.You might be dissapointed by buying a 300watt light that puts out 1000lm. where a newer tech 200watt one might put out 3000Lm.
Something to check out before you buy.
Do you want more Lumens or for your meter to spin faster while putting out less lumens?
I've been thinking about checking out a mix of cool , white and warm white LEDS to see how they do.
They are generally cheaper for higher Lumens but I tried just 1 colour of white 10mm LED and my plants did not like it.
I don't know what the K was or Lumens, they were given to me.
You would have to see what colour temp. the spots are to see if they are putting out the right wave lengths of light.
In general from 5000 - 6000k.Though some people use 3500k in fluorescent light...
Your link is a multi chip LED.
Each of the squares is an LED.
from what i've read white isn't the best color for doing it because it will actually cause a decrease in photosynthesis. one of my professors told me it's the same thing as in a rainbow... you actually never see the green in a rainbow because it would just come at you as white light since it's in the middle of the spectrum and would be a combination of all the colors. so basically they don't absorb it well and they can't photosynthesize enough to support themselves. if you give them only the spectrums that activate photosynth. A&B they'll maximize efficiency. And if you give them i think it's 720 or 730nm infra red it causes a boost in growth because it activates some gene in them.
oh and i figured out where my backwards logic was now... you're right, those are just an array of the smaller low power chips.
oh and i figured out where my backwards logic was now... you're right, those are just an array of the smaller low power chips.
I will probably give them a try sometime a couple of thoughts:
1 Didn't see a lot of specs. I want to see the wavelengths for the white lights.
2. The price with their drivers are very nice.
3. Curious about controlling heat. Probably no big deal.
4. I am in the minority (I think) but I prefer brand names like CREE. Partly due to my own ignorance and lack of expertise and testing equipment.
1 Didn't see a lot of specs. I want to see the wavelengths for the white lights.
2. The price with their drivers are very nice.
3. Curious about controlling heat. Probably no big deal.
4. I am in the minority (I think) but I prefer brand names like CREE. Partly due to my own ignorance and lack of expertise and testing equipment.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-LED-Plant-Grow-Light-Panel-14W-Red-Blue-LED-Promoting-Plant-Growing-/190623360931?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c6209a7a3
what you guys think? and its only 14 watts, i wanted to buy it but i thought i post first and get a couple cents on this.
what you guys think? and its only 14 watts, i wanted to buy it but i thought i post first and get a couple cents on this.
that will start maybe 4 seedlings and when they get about 2 inches tall you can only have one under that ans when that plant gets about 6 inches tall it is no use anymore if you are going to buy a light panel you should not spend less than $150.00 and it should at least be 100 watts.I would say 99.9% of these cheapo led panels are made with cheapo chinese leds and they dont work worth a $#!
you might as well buy these if you want to spend 30bucks http://www.amazon.com/ALZO-Digital-Full-Spectrum-Light/dp/B00198U6U6/ref=pd_cp_hi_0
those 100 watt leds look like they put out around 8000 lumens each
http://www.amazon.co...ref=pd_sim_hi_2
how about this one?, i want something that is low on watts but its gonna grow my plants till they get couple sets of leaves then i gonna take advantage of the cali weather. i have 12 seedlings right now, thanks for help btw
how about this one?, i want something that is low on watts but its gonna grow my plants till they get couple sets of leaves then i gonna take advantage of the cali weather. i have 12 seedlings right now, thanks for help btw
Watts means nothing as far as how bright the light is.
Watts is how fast your meter spins.Volts times Amps = watts.Has nothing to do with any specific LED's Lumens/brightness in general.Though you can't get 5000Lm. 1 watt LED's.
1 watt LEDs don't go over 100lm run at max miliamps which will eventually fry them.
High Lumen LEDs are usually a bunch of smaller LEDs put together to make a lot of Lumens.
I have 1 watt LEDS that are anywhere from 24lm to 100Lm,if the data sheets are true.
I have 3 watt LED that are 25lm up to 200lm.
You need to know what LEDS they are using (size LED,Lumen and angle of the beam/LED) in that light.
Also a lot of times they have cooling fans that are X amount of watts and they are giving you a total watt rate for the whole panel.
You need to know what the LEDs are - 3mm , 8mm , 5mm , 10mm etc.Also what Lumen they are each.
Generally the cheaper the panel,the lower the Lumen Output.
A lot of the $30. ones are junk and the stats are garbage,snake oil salesmen sell tons of them.
Just like Fluoros,you can have T12 fixtures that are 40watts but put bulbs in them that are anywhere from 1200lm to 3500lm.
It's still a 40 watt light no matter what the Lumens of the bulb are.
I've never used compact Fluoros.
Watts is how fast your meter spins.Volts times Amps = watts.Has nothing to do with any specific LED's Lumens/brightness in general.Though you can't get 5000Lm. 1 watt LED's.
1 watt LEDs don't go over 100lm run at max miliamps which will eventually fry them.
High Lumen LEDs are usually a bunch of smaller LEDs put together to make a lot of Lumens.
I have 1 watt LEDS that are anywhere from 24lm to 100Lm,if the data sheets are true.
I have 3 watt LED that are 25lm up to 200lm.
You need to know what LEDS they are using (size LED,Lumen and angle of the beam/LED) in that light.
Also a lot of times they have cooling fans that are X amount of watts and they are giving you a total watt rate for the whole panel.
You need to know what the LEDs are - 3mm , 8mm , 5mm , 10mm etc.Also what Lumen they are each.
Generally the cheaper the panel,the lower the Lumen Output.
A lot of the $30. ones are junk and the stats are garbage,snake oil salesmen sell tons of them.
Just like Fluoros,you can have T12 fixtures that are 40watts but put bulbs in them that are anywhere from 1200lm to 3500lm.
It's still a 40 watt light no matter what the Lumens of the bulb are.
I've never used compact Fluoros.
if you want to go the cfl way you can make your own light using one of thesehttp://www.lightbulb..._464_90_464.asp and youll have to wire in a powercordhttp://www.amazon.co...ref=pd_sim_hi_2
how about this one?, i want something that is low on watts but its gonna grow my plants till they get couple sets of leaves then i gonna take advantage of the cali weather. i have 12 seedlings right now, thanks for help btw
and get 4 of these which would be 85 dollars for 340watts 17000 lumens 5500k http://www.amazon.co...ref=pd_sim_hi_2
and make a reflector for it
and if you use the bulbs that i posted before you will get 32bucks for 180 watts 11200 lumens 5500k do 2 of these youll use 20 more wattage as the first setup but you will have 22400 lumens
there are many diy video on youtube for a cfl growlight fixture kinda like this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ublsS9Fpm7M
Your right in a sense, but your explination is kind of confusing because i think your mixing knowledge of traditional lights that use full specturm with LEDs which don't. You do need to pay attention to Watts with LEDS. You just don't want to look at total wattage. You need to focus more so on the wattage of EACH LED. Lumens means absoultely NOTHING when it comes to LEDs. You don't give a shit about lumens because your not using full spectrum LEDs. Your using LEDs balanced at the correct light spectrum of blue, deep blue, red, and deep red. Here is a link to a good explination. http://www.lumigrow.com/demystifying-lumens-lux-par/
The reason you want to look at the wattage of each LED is because the higher output LEDS give you better light penetration, allowing you to grow plants to full cycle. You then also have to account for the lenses and angle of the lenses on the LEDs. 60 degree, 90, etc. They focus the light at those angles which in turn effects your coverage area. Having LEDs focused at 60 degrees is pretty much straight down, you will get great light penetration, but you would need far more LEDs or a much larger panel to cover a specific area.
You will find most of the high end LED manufacterers are using high end 5w LEDs angled at 90 or 120 and are seeing very good results. However they also cost an arm and a leg. I think the cheapest is around $450 for a coverage area of 3x3.
Also remember, with LED in order to get the most light out of a panel, it needs to be placed within a 12-18 inches of your plants. This can decrease the coverage area as well.
For the average person ,Watts means a better grow light...
They look at adds for snake oil and think Watts means how bright the light is.
Then when their light sucks they post how LEDS suck in general.
Painting a dog turd gold doesn't make it not stink,but not all gold things stink.
I posted accordingly.
Watts per Lumen matters as far as cost of operation also.
People will back off using LEDS and possibly screw themselves out of a great light source because people like me and you confuse them and we start sounding like "If you can't Dazzle them with Brilliance,Baffle them with B,S.".
LEDs or plant lighting is pretty simple,people make it sound complicated when it isn't in general.
It depends on what you are growing and for what stage you need to grow them to.
I use mainly 1 watt LEDS for my shelves and ,in general never use them for much else except a full grown plant or 2.
I started out using 3 watt LEDS but 1 watt ones do just as well for my application.
I should note that I put Leds both Horizontally above my plants and vertically around 3 sides with Mylar in front.
With LEDS vertically you have to put something in front of them or you get blinded whenever you look in that direction and they reflect off everything in the room.
Most people only would use LEDS for growing plants that will go outside eventually.
Not growing them under LEDS for a crop.
Might make a big difference as far as LED watts/lumen goes.
The 18in away thing might be for the wider angled stars.
I've found that different LEDS ,even from the same lot all have their sweet spot and it depends on how many you have on a panel-how many per sq. in. per panel as to their coverage.
I've found 10mm,40 degree angled 106lm +/- LEDs work better from 24-36 inches away.
BUT they only came in high enough Lumens recently in the high reds to be worth using.
Mixing LED lots and wave lengths also is better for my plants I think.
As long as they are rated as 430nm - 480nm and 629nm - 680nm.
Also note that an LEDs rated output is only what wave length it puts out the most of.
It puts out other wave lengths in higher and lower wave lengths also.
I also think that you don't have to worry about some of the blue or red wave lengths some literature claims you need to put LEDS in your panel for.
There are enough Lumens of most of those wave lengths from your LEDS in lesser amounts to give the plant what it wants.
Assuming you are not just using a couple LEDS in only a few wave lengths.
Another + for lower Lumen LEDS but more of them.
Note that the rated average wave length might not be what the data sheet claims.
Which to me is a good thing.
Gives me more wave lengths per panel,closer to real sunlight as far as plant usable wave lengths goes.
You might be right about watts for your application but for what I'm using mine for I don't think how you measure the light matters much as long as you always use the same yardstick.Lumens(measure of visible light for the human eye which happens to be pretty much what plants use the most of) ,LUX (Lumens per Sq.Meter),Par whatever.
Use the same yardstick from the same point of reference and you're ok in general for how I use them,for my application.
I've found different papers that say Lumens,Par or Lux won't measure LEDS accurately.
It's easy to find a study that will prove anything you want to prove.
All say their way is the only way.
My plants decide for me.
Especially with a fast evolving light source like LEDS.The tech changes almost daily.
I see no difference between using 50 1 watt Leds as opposed to 15 or 20 3 watt leds except in price.
My LUX meter reads the same from laying it under the plant on the soil for both panels.
Both LEDS put out about the same Lumens that I used,measure the same or close to the same lux under the starts.
I got 300-500 1 watt LEDS for half or less the cost of 3 watt LEDS.
I don't have to cool 1 watt LEDS like I do 3 watt ones.
I make my panels with the LEDS placed about 1 LEDS space between them in general.Be it 1 watt or 3 watt LEDs.
My LEDS are permanently placed between 22 and 24 inches away from my plants from hook until they go outside on my shelf (or will be when I'm finished building all of them).
For my bigger plants the panels vary in distance away due to my limited growing space indoors.
My starter plant leaf nods are very close together and my plants are generally short and fat as far as growth and start branching early at about 3 nodes.
Once they go outside they are an instant hedge with the tight branching I get once they start to spread out in their #15 pots.
As I said,I use my LEDS for mainly starter plants.
I use mine and design my panels for my specific use and what you are concerned about doesn't apply to my application in general.
You are talking about a totally different application than most of the people who want to try LEDs out to just start their plants.
All I want is 8-10in plants with hand sized leaves to go outside.
I'm not talking about growing under them for any other reason except to keep a couple indoors for pure seed until they set pods.
Once a pod is formed the plant goes out and another takes it's place.
Except my kitchen plant.
That window has reflective film.It doesn't let much light in of the right quality to grow plants(Had to hang the fluoro).
There are 3 10mm LED panels and a 4 bulb and dual shop light fluoro on the plant.
It's 5ft tall X 8ft+ wide.
Needs a new home but it always has too many pods on it so I keep saying I'll wait for them to ripen then get rid of it. LOL
http://pbr403.photob...cs/PICT2175.jpg
LEDs are off in picture.
I hear the fridge and freezer open and close at night then the microwave run.
It likes it's midnight munchies.7 pot SR strain F4.
They look at adds for snake oil and think Watts means how bright the light is.
Then when their light sucks they post how LEDS suck in general.
Painting a dog turd gold doesn't make it not stink,but not all gold things stink.
I posted accordingly.
Watts per Lumen matters as far as cost of operation also.
People will back off using LEDS and possibly screw themselves out of a great light source because people like me and you confuse them and we start sounding like "If you can't Dazzle them with Brilliance,Baffle them with B,S.".
LEDs or plant lighting is pretty simple,people make it sound complicated when it isn't in general.
It depends on what you are growing and for what stage you need to grow them to.
I use mainly 1 watt LEDS for my shelves and ,in general never use them for much else except a full grown plant or 2.
I started out using 3 watt LEDS but 1 watt ones do just as well for my application.
I should note that I put Leds both Horizontally above my plants and vertically around 3 sides with Mylar in front.
With LEDS vertically you have to put something in front of them or you get blinded whenever you look in that direction and they reflect off everything in the room.
Most people only would use LEDS for growing plants that will go outside eventually.
Not growing them under LEDS for a crop.
Might make a big difference as far as LED watts/lumen goes.
The 18in away thing might be for the wider angled stars.
I've found that different LEDS ,even from the same lot all have their sweet spot and it depends on how many you have on a panel-how many per sq. in. per panel as to their coverage.
I've found 10mm,40 degree angled 106lm +/- LEDs work better from 24-36 inches away.
BUT they only came in high enough Lumens recently in the high reds to be worth using.
Mixing LED lots and wave lengths also is better for my plants I think.
As long as they are rated as 430nm - 480nm and 629nm - 680nm.
Also note that an LEDs rated output is only what wave length it puts out the most of.
It puts out other wave lengths in higher and lower wave lengths also.
I also think that you don't have to worry about some of the blue or red wave lengths some literature claims you need to put LEDS in your panel for.
There are enough Lumens of most of those wave lengths from your LEDS in lesser amounts to give the plant what it wants.
Assuming you are not just using a couple LEDS in only a few wave lengths.
Another + for lower Lumen LEDS but more of them.
Note that the rated average wave length might not be what the data sheet claims.
Which to me is a good thing.
Gives me more wave lengths per panel,closer to real sunlight as far as plant usable wave lengths goes.
You might be right about watts for your application but for what I'm using mine for I don't think how you measure the light matters much as long as you always use the same yardstick.Lumens(measure of visible light for the human eye which happens to be pretty much what plants use the most of) ,LUX (Lumens per Sq.Meter),Par whatever.
Use the same yardstick from the same point of reference and you're ok in general for how I use them,for my application.
I've found different papers that say Lumens,Par or Lux won't measure LEDS accurately.
It's easy to find a study that will prove anything you want to prove.
All say their way is the only way.
My plants decide for me.
Especially with a fast evolving light source like LEDS.The tech changes almost daily.
I see no difference between using 50 1 watt Leds as opposed to 15 or 20 3 watt leds except in price.
My LUX meter reads the same from laying it under the plant on the soil for both panels.
Both LEDS put out about the same Lumens that I used,measure the same or close to the same lux under the starts.
I got 300-500 1 watt LEDS for half or less the cost of 3 watt LEDS.
I don't have to cool 1 watt LEDS like I do 3 watt ones.
I make my panels with the LEDS placed about 1 LEDS space between them in general.Be it 1 watt or 3 watt LEDs.
My LEDS are permanently placed between 22 and 24 inches away from my plants from hook until they go outside on my shelf (or will be when I'm finished building all of them).
For my bigger plants the panels vary in distance away due to my limited growing space indoors.
My starter plant leaf nods are very close together and my plants are generally short and fat as far as growth and start branching early at about 3 nodes.
Once they go outside they are an instant hedge with the tight branching I get once they start to spread out in their #15 pots.
As I said,I use my LEDS for mainly starter plants.
I use mine and design my panels for my specific use and what you are concerned about doesn't apply to my application in general.
You are talking about a totally different application than most of the people who want to try LEDs out to just start their plants.
All I want is 8-10in plants with hand sized leaves to go outside.
I'm not talking about growing under them for any other reason except to keep a couple indoors for pure seed until they set pods.
Once a pod is formed the plant goes out and another takes it's place.
Except my kitchen plant.
That window has reflective film.It doesn't let much light in of the right quality to grow plants(Had to hang the fluoro).
There are 3 10mm LED panels and a 4 bulb and dual shop light fluoro on the plant.
It's 5ft tall X 8ft+ wide.
Needs a new home but it always has too many pods on it so I keep saying I'll wait for them to ripen then get rid of it. LOL
http://pbr403.photob...cs/PICT2175.jpg
LEDs are off in picture.
I hear the fridge and freezer open and close at night then the microwave run.
It likes it's midnight munchies.7 pot SR strain F4.
I agree with you in many aspects. It is completely up to what you are looking to get out of your light. If you are only looking to grow plants big enough to then be moved outside, then by all means all you would really need is 1watt LEDS on a huge panel. However if you ever wanted to grow something full cycle 1watt LED's simply won't cut it. 3watt LEDs may do full cycle depending on the lense you use, it all varies on what plants you are growing to. Lettuce and such can probably be grown to full cycle with 1watt LEDs. Tomatos? Peppers? Not a chance.
I however disagree with your measuring methods. Regardless of how you measure the light, even if its from the same "yardstick" per say, that's irrelevant. You are still measuring it with a device that isn't ment to be used in the first place. Just because you get the same reading every time doesn't mean its the right reading. You are simply getting the right reading that those meters can provide. But in reality it's still wrong. Plain and simple.
The reason your plants grow so well is because you know the correct growing spectrum LEDs to use. It has nothing to do with the measurments you are getting. If you were to measure your lights with the right tool, you would probably be able to improve or see that you need more reds or more blues in your setup to produce better growth.
Its hard for people to understand LED lighting because there is a ton of info out there that is just simply wrong. And its kind of confusing as well. My explination of having to have the lights 12-18 inches away from the plants is a good example. I based that off of the fact that most people use 90-120 degree lenses. You don't HAVE to have them that close. Plants will still grow from 24-36 inches away, they just won't grow as fast. That's all. However you state that you have used 40 degree. That obviously focuses the light to an extreme amount so you would be able to increase the distance quite a bit. Most DIY lights are using 60 degree lenses with 3watt LEDs. It all varies really depending on what you want to grow, and to what cycle stage you are wanting to grow to.
I however disagree with your measuring methods. Regardless of how you measure the light, even if its from the same "yardstick" per say, that's irrelevant. You are still measuring it with a device that isn't ment to be used in the first place. Just because you get the same reading every time doesn't mean its the right reading. You are simply getting the right reading that those meters can provide. But in reality it's still wrong. Plain and simple.
The reason your plants grow so well is because you know the correct growing spectrum LEDs to use. It has nothing to do with the measurments you are getting. If you were to measure your lights with the right tool, you would probably be able to improve or see that you need more reds or more blues in your setup to produce better growth.
Its hard for people to understand LED lighting because there is a ton of info out there that is just simply wrong. And its kind of confusing as well. My explination of having to have the lights 12-18 inches away from the plants is a good example. I based that off of the fact that most people use 90-120 degree lenses. You don't HAVE to have them that close. Plants will still grow from 24-36 inches away, they just won't grow as fast. That's all. However you state that you have used 40 degree. That obviously focuses the light to an extreme amount so you would be able to increase the distance quite a bit. Most DIY lights are using 60 degree lenses with 3watt LEDs. It all varies really depending on what you want to grow, and to what cycle stage you are wanting to grow to.