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Calcium for plants

I've been using Foli-Cal (10% calcium Acetate) on my plants for budding etc.(C.Chinense like lots of Calcium).
Foli Cal concentrate is anywhere from $9.00 - $19.00 for 16 oz.
Foli Cal works great on plants and at keeping my wallet empty.
Looking for a cheeper way to get it.

I read on a science site you can make Calcium Acetate by mixing 6 grams of Lime with 100 ML. of 5% vinegar to get the same thing.
MUCH cheeper to make(assuming it's really the same stuff).
I'm going to try it out Maybe tomorrow...

Any Chemistry wiz here to advise about making this and is it safe for plants-same stuff?

Several sites said the same info so it looks ok if you can trust what others posted on these sites...
 
I've been using Foli-Cal (10% calcium Acetate) on my plants for budding etc.(C.Chinense like lots of Calcium).
Foli Cal concentrate is anywhere from $9.00 - $19.00 for 16 oz.
Foli Cal works great on plants and at keeping my wallet empty.
Looking for a cheeper way to get it.

I read on a science site you can make Calcium Acetate by mixing 6 grams of Lime with 100 ML. of 5% vinegar to get the same thing.
MUCH cheeper to make(assuming it's really the same stuff).
I'm going to try it out Maybe tomorrow...

Any Chemistry wiz here to advise about making this and is it safe for plants-same stuff?

Several sites said the same info so it looks ok if you can trust what others posted on these sites...

Another method to get calcium phosphate for plants is using eggshells and vinegar;
http://tinyurl.com/25lwjed
That's a link to my blog with complete (easy) instructions for making it. I've done it, I've used it, and it works! Safe and it works. Cheers.
 
I add wood-ash and egg/seafood shells to my tomato garden for extra calcium but my chiles never seem to need it, just magnesium, but maybe it has to do with my hard well water
 
I add wood-ash and egg/seafood shells to my tomato garden for extra calcium but my chiles never seem to need it, just magnesium, but maybe it has to do with my hard well water

I've got the same water situation; ph 7.68. Thailand (central, where I live) is rife with limestone formations and the huge number of caves that go with it; which is why all available water is so damn hard. I've never read anything that indicated this was available calcium for plants. I'd thought of that, but haven't read anything that confirms this is so.
Have you got any info on this? Cheers.
 
I don't see any reason why calcium in hard water can't be used by the plants, I believe its just calcium carbonate.
 
Sounds quitep plausible to me. I got me a deep well too. Been using that to water my plants the past dry season. Rainy season now. Rain water harvesting mode.
 
I've been using Foli-Cal (10% calcium Acetate) on my plants for budding etc.(C.Chinense like lots of Calcium).
Foli Cal concentrate is anywhere from $9.00 - $19.00 for 16 oz.
Foli Cal works great on plants and at keeping my wallet empty.
Looking for a cheeper way to get it.

I read on a science site you can make Calcium Acetate by mixing 6 grams of Lime with 100 ML. of 5% vinegar to get the same thing.
MUCH cheeper to make(assuming it's really the same stuff).
I'm going to try it out Maybe tomorrow...

Any Chemistry wiz here to advise about making this and is it safe for plants-same stuff?

Several sites said the same info so it looks ok if you can trust what others posted on these sites...


Hey smoke,

Assuming the lime is around 70% Calcium Carbonate, the mixing of 6 grams with 100 mL of 5% vinegar should give you calcium acetate. Maybe someone can check my math but you're going to end up with around 6-7% calcium acetate. Probably the best you're gonna get since the vinegar's dilute. On the plus side, your final product will have some magnesium. I've never mixed the two but I think vinegar's acidic enough to dissolve the lime. Chemistry wise it looks like a safe reaction. You might get some carbon dioxide bubbles forming if it does dissolve. Good luck.
 
I run egg shells thru a food grinder to make powder, cook till good and black poor into jar poor in equal amount of white vinegar let sit for a week to let vinegar dissolve cooked shells, mix 2 tablespoons of liquid to gal of water spray on plants, works great, have been using for about 4 years
 
If egg shells are in short supply (or lime), then you could try antacid tables with vinegar, but check that these tables contain calcium carbonate and not other metals like (sodium, potassium, aluminium or magnesium) which are sometimes used in antacid tablets.

The reaction of antacids tablets (calcium carbonate) and vinegar (acetic acid in water) produces calcium acetate and bubbles (of carbon dioxide). When no more calcium carbonate remains, the reaction will stop and so no more bubbles will be produced. Therefore the lack of bubbles will let you know when the reaction is over. Also at the end of the reaction the vinegar taste should also have disappeared.

Therefore, you could by adding antacid tablets (best crushed) to cheap white spirit vinegar to get calcium acetate.

Therefore, if I was doing this reaction I would use the following method:
  • Step 1: Pour the vinegar (e.g. 100 mls) into an open container like a Pyrex jug. Do *not* use a sealable container!
  • Step 2: Add 5 to 6 crushed antacid tables to the container, stir, and leave over night (I repeat do ***NOT*** seal this container, as the gas (carbon dioxide) produced would probably cause a sealed vessel to crack or even :onfire: explode :onfire: , due to too much pressure being trapped inside the sealed vessel!!!! (i.e. like a ballon which has been blown up too far)) – keep a record of tablets added.
  • Step 3: Sniff the container in the morning. If it still smells like vinegar repeat Step 2, but maybe using fewer antacid tablets (e.g. 2 or 3).
  • Step 4: If the solution no longer smells like vinegar, dip your finger in and taste a little. If it taste sour repeat step 2 (again perhaps using fewer antacid tables).
  • Step 5: It is probably best not to add more antacid tablets than needed to neutralise the acid, as calcium carbonate is a little basic. Therefore too much calcium carbonate might cause your soil's pH to rise. If you are worried that there is too much vinegar left in solution you could allow the solution to evaporate – acetic acid will evaporate over time. Too much acetic acid will lower your soil's pH.
  • Step 6: Once you know the ratio of antacid tablets needed to neutralise the volume of vinegar used, you can repeat this process when ever you need to (as long as you use the same brands of antacid and vinegar!)

I've had a quick look at Thaichillihead numbers mentioned above, and they seem about right.

I've also had a look at approximate number of antacid tablets needed to neutralise vinegar. The problem is that vinegar seems to be sold in different concentrations i.e. from about 5% to 15% acetic acid in water.

Therefore based on the antacid tablets containing 500 mg of calcium carbonate per tablet, you would need:

:: About 17 (500 mg) antacid tables for 100 ml of vinegar (when the vinegar contains 5% acetic acid), giving about 13 g of calcium acetate.

:: About 27 (500 mg) antacid tables for 100 ml of vinegar (when the vinegar contains 8% acetic acid). giving about 21 g of calcium acetate.

:: About 33 (500 mg) antacid tables for 100 ml of vinegar (when the vinegar contains 10% acetic acid). giving about 26 g of calcium acetate.

:: About 40 (500 mg) antacid tables for 100 ml of vinegar (when the vinegar contains 12% acetic acid). giving about 32 g of calcium acetate.

:: About 50 (500 mg) antacid tables for 100 ml of vinegar (when the vinegar contains 15% acetic acid). giving about 40g of calcium acetate.


A quick search indicates that Foli-Cal is a 10% solution of calcium acetate (maybe has other good stuff in it too?). In that case 1L of Foli-cla would contain about 100 g of calcium acetate.

Therefore, using about 125 (500 mg) antacid tablets with 750 ml (5%) vinegar, topped up to 1 litre would give you about the same concentration of calcium acetate as is in Foli-Cal. I think making your own solution from antacid tablets and vinegar would cost about 5 bucks ??

Based on the above numbers, making calcium acetate from antacid and vinegar seems more cost effective than buying Foli-Cal … :confused:

The only problem I can see is that the antacid tablets might contain other stuff like flavours etc ...
 
Hi MotaMike

Calcium in antacid tablets is calcium carbonate, this reacts with acetic acid in vinegar to give calcium acetate:

(for reaction see: http://wiki.answers.com/Q/How_does_vinegar_and_calcium_carbonate_react)

smokemaster states that Foli-Cal contains 10% calcium acetate (see: http://www.montereylawngarden.com/pdf/foli_cal_02.pdf) and that his plants respond well to Foli-cal.

Therefore, the reaction above should work to give calcium acetate. However, see the various caveats given above! Particularly, checking that the antacid contains calcium carbonate and not magnesium, sodium, potassium aluminium bases, and making sure that not too much vinegar or antacid tablets are used.

It looks like my plants are suffering quite badly from lack of calcium so I will try to make some and test it on my plants and then report back!

I'd be interested to see if anyone else gives it a go and how they got on!

CH
 
I would think that lime would be more cost effective than antacid tablets, not to mention the possible caveats mentioned above, but I haven't checked . . .
 
Wait....What ever happened to just using gypsum? Your really going to go through all of that with the egg shells hahahaha.



I want to note that the egg shell in vinegar is a very old known way to get Ca. I have heard it a LONG time ago.



Another option is to just buy a fertilizer that has all Macro/Micronutrients right in it then wondering how to get "calcium" is just a thing of the past. I use MaxiBloom by General Hydroponics, It has so much Ca in it I would never need a Ca/Mg. Nothing like mixing one fertilizer. It will cost 8cent to mix up a gal of maxi bloom at full strength.
 
Wait....What ever happened to just using gypsum? Your really going to go through all of that with the egg shells hahahaha.

Most people have eggshells on hand, hence using them as an easy calcium source. Around here, I can't get gypsum in a bag smaller than 30lbs, which is kinda a pain to store. I might have to check out maxi-bloom though, 8cents/gallon is hard to beat.
 
Go to any construction site & look through the bins for off cuts of drywall. peel of the paper & smash to a powder, free.

Mezo.
 
Another method to get calcium phosphate for plants is using eggshells and vinegar;
http://tinyurl.com/25lwjed
That's a link to my blog with complete (easy) instructions for making it. I've done it, I've used it, and it works! Safe and it works. Cheers.

I have a question regarding this method, I crushed egg sheels into small pieces, bit podwery and put them in vingear, it didnt dissolve that well.
Later on I managed to get glacial acetic acid(99%) from the university and added it, noe after about 2 months its still all didnt dissolve. I added water until all the sediment dissolved and moved the liquid to another bottle. The remaining egg shell I tried with your method by cooking them until they turned black and added same volume of vinger. Now the liquid is black from the burnt egg shells it only been a few days so it didn't all dissolve, but I wondered if the liquid being black is still good?

And I was hoping you could make a short video showing the whole proccess, that would be great. Couldnt find any video describing it on youtube.
 
The calcium in antacid tablets cannot be utilized by the plant I thought?
Does the vinegar change that?
Yes. Calcium carbonate is in a form the plants can't take in through the roots. Its a solid. It's gotta be dissolved first. Rainwater is slightly acidic (carbonic acid), and if it comes in contact with Calcium Carbonate (Limestone) or Calcium Sulfate (Gypsum) it will dissolve the solid until the acid is used up in the reaction.
 
Hi guys!
I have recently tried the garden lime / white vinegar thang, but although there was much fizzing for the first hour i am now left with a clear liquid on top, and undisolved lime on the bottom. I have tried stirring again and again, but no more fizzing seems to want to happen. I started this 3 days ago by the way. Is this a lengthy process, or should it have all disolved by now? Oh, and it still smells really vinegary too, which i don't think is right?
Any advice is appreciated!
Thanks

Oh, and the white vinegar i used didn't say 5% anywhere. But when i looked at the ingredients it just said "white vinegar" with nothing else added. Could this be a problem? If so, what exactly is the other 95%???!
 
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