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Since the Moruga will be the next "big" one for a moment...

Hammerfall

Hammerfall

Hi guys,
most of you seen the results so far , more info to come...

i dont t enter in a debate...

My question is....
Since the 2nd runner up (The choc 7 pot) show a very interesting "low heat" higher than other...

Is tehre a guy here that already has done (or will do) a Cross of Red morouga and Choc 7 pot?

If so... any pic?
Any name for that hybrid?
Any seeds?

sure when you cross you dont have always the best of each variety... you might need to cross a lot and grow a lot to have something good...
but... maybe some guys already have start working on that...

im curous to see what could this mix lend to!

Any info someone?
 
Ok i have a small new project! i will make it up my onw (first try for me on a cross poll hybrid making pepper)

For that i will need help from the god around here...

Will need the purest seeds of TS Morouga (red) and the purest seeds of 7 pot Choc

Anyone with pureor very stable and very hot TS red Morouga seeds?
Anyone wit pure or very stable and very hot 7 Pot choc Seeds?
Just want to make a Super hot with a mean level of heat very very high.


also i will have question like:
If you grow both and both have flower that you will use for the crossing...
What is the better to cross on ?

i mean should i use the polen of the 7 pot choc on the TS Morouga plant and flower (TS wuld be the HOST plant)
or try on both?
genetically is it better to have the hottest as the host?

So if anyone could help me find some pure seeds and help me in some month (once the plant is big enough) to help me on the crossing that would be great.
sur ethis kind of project could take some "years" to have something stable but it would be very nice for me !

Thanks
 
Try on both during the same growing season. That way you can find out what the differences are as they potentially would be growing under the same conditions.
 
Good luck! I'm going to try crossing again this year since I haven't been able to get one to stick yet. It's tougher than it looks I guess... maybe I'm doing it wrong haha. I think the most exciting thing would be to plant a row of F1s and just see what comes out of it. A brown TSMB would be really cool and I'm sure hot as hell.

As far as getting a good Chocolate 7 and TSMB to use for your crossing, I would just get any old brown 7 and either a TSMB or Brain Strain. To be perfectly honest you aren't going to find a huge difference between them as far as heat goes, and flavor is pretty downright similar as well. It's starting to get a bit on the late side to be planting new supers unless you get them in the mail quick and are okay with waiting into October (I hope you don't get frosts too early where you are). Here's a good place to start looking for seeds if you can't get some around here:

www.pepperlover.com
 
Thanks MRZ.
i already have 3 red TS Morouga and 4 TS Yellow Morouga plant that has sprouted.
i only have ONE 7pot choc that as sprouted. all those seeds i think are open Pol

i was just looking to have some pure stuff to start on.

You said Brain strain... i do have some of those already in good shape.
but a Brain strain is a 7 pot not a TS . so if i want the Choc side a ineed the 7 pot Choc.

Anyone here that could send some 7 pot choc seeds?
or something much similar to a brown 7 pot with plenty of heat??

I have also growing this year a
7 pod douglah x Trinidad scorpion morouga
can this be a good start also?

anyway it's just for fun until i have some good succes in polenisation.
 
I didn't take time to completely read the comments, but I scanned them...

male - sperm - comes from the pistols...the pollen....

female - ovary - is what the stamen attaches too...

you need to get a good handle on your genetics here...its been way too long since I had it...'78 maybe...

two plants A and B

Plant A is the donar of the pollen, Plant B is the "Mother" for one cross, then Plant B is the donar of the pollen and Plant A is the Mother...these two crosses will theoretically give you separate hybrids (two F1s..call it F1a and F1b or what ever)...you may even see some hybrid vigor, larger plants, healthier..etc or just the opposite, sickly, weak plants....but their Offspring, the F2 generation can now either be grown in isolation if it has traits to it you desire, trashed, or back crossed with the parent plant that has characteristics you desire...and I think it would be good if when you get the plant you want, to grow it three consecutive seasons crossing only with itself and getting the same plants/pod shape/color/type before declaring a stable hybrid...

in other words...it takes a long time to develop a good stable hybrid...
 
from what i have read it take 8 generation to be "stable"

but i like you idea to take 2 plants and cross them on each plant.
will se result and then restart or continue.

Thanks AJ
 
6-8 is a good number for stabilization, but I was taking into consideration you would have already been through several rounds of crossing and back crossing with each succeeding generation resulting in what you are trying to achieve...
 
thanks for the info!

anyway for sure it's a great Hobby !
if i happen to make a nice frankenstein one day i will be very happy!

until then well... there is so much variety out there that i will always have some nice and stable peper in my garden for my own consumption and sauces!
 
Hammerfall said:
Thanks MRZ.
i already have 3 red TS Morouga and 4 TS Yellow Morouga plant that has sprouted.
i only have ONE 7pot choc that as sprouted. all those seeds i think are open Pol

i was just looking to have some pure stuff to start on.

You said Brain strain... i do have some of those already in good shape.
but a Brain strain is a 7 pot not a TS . so if i want the Choc side a ineed the 7 pot Choc.

Anyone here that could send some 7 pot choc seeds?
or something much similar to a brown 7 pot with plenty of heat??

I have also growing this year a
7 pod douglah x Trinidad scorpion morouga
can this be a good start also?

anyway it's just for fun until i have some good succes in polenisation.
Click to expand...

The douglah x TSMB might be a great start as the douglah is just as hot if not hotter than the chocolate 7. Sometimes the douglahs don't come out as brown but more of a burgandy, so you'll probably get mostly red pods from the crossed seed.

The Brain Strain and TSMB are both considered both 7 pots and scorpions. 7 pots and scorpions have very close genetics and are in the same family, so for the most part the terminology is interchangeable. The only thing is that you'll get in trouble for calling something a scorpion that doesn't have a stinger or at least a tail protrusion.

Hope that helps.
 
The Brain Strain itself is not a Trinidad Scorpion. However, it is not a 7 pot either. In fact the only pods I'd be willing to call a Trinidad Scorpion would be the TS Butch T and the landrace Trinidad Scorpion, as they are both essentially the same strain with a few differences in phenotype. The only pods I'm willing to call a true 7 pot are from the original red 7 pot strain. The rest are hybrids or mutants.

What I'm saying is that both the Brain Strain and the TSMB are in the same family of strains that include all 7 Pots and all Scorpions: The Trinidad Superhots. This family of pods has very close genetic traits and all superhots originating from Trinidad genetics are in this family. You will note that this is the only family whose pods develop nuclear heat and a buckling fold on the underside of the pod that frequently causes a 'stinger' to develop in some strains. The original 7 pod and the original scorpion are incredibly closely related. All pods that have acquired the 'scorpion' name or the '7 pot' name are descendants of these two strains (in one way or another), and thus had that part of the name tagged on the end. In truth, however, the difference in the names of the strains do not reflect the difference in phenotypes that we see. The Brain Strain and TSMB are prime examples of this. In practice we can see that both plants produce identical looking pods. Both are members of the Trinidad Superhot family and both show traits similar to the 7 pot and scorpion varieties, but they are neither 7 pots nor scorpions. What I'm saying is when you aren't describing a very specific phenotype such as a distinct scorpion tail, the names 7 pot and scorpion might as well be interchangeable. All they do is tell us that the pod is a member of the Trinidad Superhot family. Unfortunately there have been so many new superhots to pop up in the last decade that we have lost a lot of meaning behind the names 7 pot and scorpion. Scorpion seems to apply to any superhot that has a distinct tail, while 7 pot seems to apply to just about whatever Trinidad-related superhot we want it to. The 7 pot "Primo" is a prime example of a 7 pot with a distinct tail that we for some reason don't call a scorpion.

And so the names are muddled and have lost most of their meaning, but if you want to keep the vague meaning of them you might as well understand that they are interchangeable for the most part.
 
I'll buy that...and the landraces from 2007 are what I am growing...I have been selective now for 5 years for pod shape/size in my seed saving...and even the strain I am growing show deltas between the originals...which it should I suppose...
 
I agree with you Matt on just how muddy the genetic waters have become for superhots. Everybody and their dog is trying to outdo each other in the heat department. And it really doesn't matter to me what anyone calls them but it's confusing as hell to have so many different names for the same pepper. Why I ask is the past few years that I've been on this forum the Brain Strain has always been called a 7 Pot, 7 Pod for a while, Brain Strain. The 7 Pot Brain Strain. That's what 99% of the folks around here know it as. Now you're calling it by another name which is going to lead to more confusion.

Can't we just keep it as it is?

Edit: Forgot something. I've grown both for a few years now, not a lot of sucess with the TSMB when it comes to the number of pods on the plant, and yes the 7 Pot BS and TSMB are similar looking but I wouldn't go so far as to say they are identical.
 
I searched fo many years for 7 pods and scorpions seeds and when I finally did find 7 pods I had 4 different sources, and all seeds grew out almost identical. It wasn't until several years later that all these "new" 7 varieties were created or found. Back then it was easy to tell a scorpion from a 7 pod by looks and flavor. These days every time a pod shows a "tail" people think they have a new scorpion variety or if the pod is bumpy they call it a 7 pod, or when there is a cross people tend to name it after the more popular parent
Did the Brainstrain not come from Scorpion-SR seeds, or was it 7 pod-SR seeds?
 
The real name is that using jim duffy

and that he also used Chris ... and that we used in so many since 2007/2008

and that is trinidad scorpion morouga or morouga blend

then it is called differently in subsequent years

imho they are the same strains ... taking different forms, which then tries to stabilize

This has made ​​the CARDI ... those with the tip called them Scorpion those not called them 7 pod

enough to see the original photos of CARDI

7 pod

cardi.jpg


Trinidad scorpion

cardi%201.JPG


© Herman Adams, CARDI



over time, work began stabilization of different varieties .... and the differentiating element is always the presence of the tip
 
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