Any Hard Cider Guys on Here

For my two cents, I've been brewing for 20 years at this point and the two most requested items are still my hard ciders and metheglins (spiced mead).  Folks love a properly spiced brew.  I've gone through a number of different yeasts over the years, but I still find myself coming back to Nottingham consistently for my ciders.  If you make a starter, that stuff goes HARD (bring a blowoff tube kind of hard) and produces a great result.  It comes out a lot cleaner on the taste than many of the other standby yeasts and it's a beast in terms of fermentation speed.
 
(Edit:  Best protip in the cider game is to carb with concentrate if you bottle.  In the unfortunate event that your yeast craps out before fully carbing, you'll be left with a great additional flavor and sweetness as opposed to the "ugh...corn sugar" flavor you might get otherwise.  If you keg, no worries; but if you bottle carb just use 1 can of [pick your juice] concentrate per 5 gallons for pretty optimal results.)
 
Canes1 said:
What is Brett?
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It's short for Brettanomyces, which is a yeast that occurs naturally on the skins of fruit.  You don't want it in wine, but it's great in beer.  It was traditionally considered a wine contaminant, but it was somewhat naturally occurring in the crappy farmhouse ales people were forced to supply to their fieldhands and it turned out to properly own in certain types of ale.  Brett leaves a VERY distinct flavor in whatever you brew with it.  I'll probably have to try the 100% Brett fermented cider Weebz mentioned in a future batch, because I love the sound of it.  Go to your local brewshop and buy a saison style farmhouse ale like the Saison DuPont or Boulevard's Tank 7.  Brett is the major flavor characteristic in those ales that you probably can't place.
 
I tapped the first batch of Perry that I made this fall and it is delicious.  I back sweetened it with Stevia and will probably cut back a little in the next batch.  I prefer a little more tartness.  The second batch is still hanging out in the carboy.  I added 3 lbs of honey to that one so it should end up about 7.5% alcohol.  I will likely back sweeten that one a little less and maybe add some pear flavor back in.  Unfortunately I am out of corny kegs, so I have a Bourbon Barrel Porter and a cider with nowhere to go.
 
I found out this year that my brother-in-law has some prolific apple trees on his property.  So next year, I'm definitely getting a new juicer, and some more carboys.
 
Should have never read this thread.  Haven't brewed in almost 20 years so I picked up a gallon of juice and some Nottingham yeast just after Thanksgiving.   
 
After a couple of weeks, poured (don't have any real homebrew equipment) into some containers to cold crash in the refrigerator.  
 
Decided to try some apple jack...
 

 
Thanks!
 
 
 
grantmichaels said:
Cool. Never have made cider, somehow ...
 
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Hard cider is relatively easy but making it taste like cider takes a little practice. Fermented out dry, hard cider ends up tasting more like a dry white wine at first. Some of the apple flavor returns as it ages. Adding a can of frozen apple juice concentrate is the easy way but that will require killing the yeast either with chemicals or pasteurization.
 
You can add 1 can of frozen concentrate per gallon of cider and then ferment that. ABV will be higher but it hangs on to a fair amount of apple flavor.
 
Ferment as cold as possible too and give the yeast some nutrients. Fermenting ciders will create a sulfur smell. Fermented cold and keeping the yeast happy helps cut down on the "rhino farts". Ale yeasts like Nottingham's work well for cold fermentation. Champagne yeast do as well or better in the cold.
 
The only yeast i would totally avoid is Lavlin 71B-1122, It will strip out as much as 40% of the mailc acid. Malic acid is what makes apples tart. There might be other yeasts of the type too and they should be avoided for ciders except maybe for cran-apple if you think the juice is too tart.
 
Thanks to ShowMeDaSauce, I did a little reading on homebrew rice wine.  Picked up some supplies at the local Asian grocery store and started two batches. One with Thai Jasmine rice (on the left) and one with black glutenous rice (right).  Should be ready in about 20 more days.
 

 
 
Get regular sticky rice next time. Black rice can turn out funky because it still has the bran. Jasmine does end up with a very interesting aroma. Very fruity. My favorite is Red Yeast Rice mixed with the yeast balls. You grind a few tbs of the RYR with the yeast balls and add that to your cooked/cooled rice. The final product tastes so much like a fruit wine its amazing.
 
I rinse the hell out of rice first before cooking it. I also soak it for no less than 2 hours. Make sure its completely cooled to room temp before adding the yeast ball mix. Warmer and wetter rice makes it more tart because more lactic acid is created.
 
 
 
ShowMeDaSauce said:
Get regular sticky rice next time. Black rice can turn out funky because it still has the bran. Jasmine does end up with a very interesting aroma. Very fruity. My favorite is Red Yeast Rice mixed with the yeast balls. You grind a few tbs of the RYR with the yeast balls and add that to your cooked/cooled rice. The final product tastes so much like a fruit wine its amazing.
 
I rinse the hell out of rice first before cooking it. I also soak it for no less than 2 hours. Make sure its completely cooled to room temp before adding the yeast ball mix. Warmer and wetter rice makes it more tart because more lactic acid is created.
 
 
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Thanks for the heads up on the black rice.  i wasn't able to find any red yeast rice while at the Asian grocery store.  Note - I'll be looking try your blackberry wine recipe in the spring. 
 
Only one market near me carries red yeast rice. Its almost a Chinese version of Koji which is used for sake mainly. I have used Koji also but it is really expensive. You can actually use red yeast rice or Koji with a wine yeast such as K1V-1116. Give the red yeast rice a few days to do "its thing" converting some of the starch to sugar Add the wine yeast in a good starter with minimal water and sugar.
 
K1V-1116 is the "yeast killer yeast". I will devour any other yeasts present and its cold tolerant too. Its also good for 18% ABV. If your rice wine turns out too sweet, Strain it, cold crash until clear. Then siphon it off into a fresh jar or carboy. Add the K1V-1116.....It wont be sweet for long. That yeast is a hungry monster. It will probably be dry as a bone within a week :D
 
ShowMeDaSauce said:
 Black rice can turn out funky because it still has the bran. 
 
 
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Just pulled the black rice test batch.  A little sour but has the alcohol.  
 
@ShowMeDaSauce - can you post a pic of the packaging of red yeast rice you use?  
 
Slug said:
For my two cents, I've been brewing for 20 years at this point and the two most requested items are still my hard ciders and metheglins (spiced mead).  Folks love a properly spiced brew.  I've gone through a number of different yeasts over the years, but I still find myself coming back to Nottingham consistently for my ciders.  If you make a starter, that stuff goes HARD (bring a blowoff tube kind of hard) and produces a great result.  It comes out a lot cleaner on the taste than many of the other standby yeasts and it's a beast in terms of fermentation speed.
 
(Edit:  Best protip in the cider game is to carb with concentrate if you bottle.  In the unfortunate event that your yeast craps out before fully carbing, you'll be left with a great additional flavor and sweetness as opposed to the "ugh...corn sugar" flavor you might get otherwise.  If you keg, no worries; but if you bottle carb just use 1 can of [pick your juice] concentrate per 5 gallons for pretty optimal results.)
 
 
It's short for Brettanomyces, which is a yeast that occurs naturally on the skins of fruit.  You don't want it in wine, but it's great in beer.  It was traditionally considered a wine contaminant, but it was somewhat naturally occurring in the crappy farmhouse ales people were forced to supply to their fieldhands and it turned out to properly own in certain types of ale.  Brett leaves a VERY distinct flavor in whatever you brew with it.  I'll probably have to try the 100% Brett fermented cider Weebz mentioned in a future batch, because I love the sound of it.  Go to your local brewshop and buy a saison style farmhouse ale like the Saison DuPont or Boulevard's Tank 7.  Brett is the major flavor characteristic in those ales that you probably can't place.
Click to expand...
Thanks for tips on yeast looking to do a Cider after Spiced pumpkin wine still in bucket

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Greenguru said:
Thanks for tips on yeast looking to do a Cider after Spiced pumpkin wine still in bucket

Sent from my SM-T377P using Tapatalk
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Remember that a pure cider is pretty much an apple wine & thus gets better with age.  It tastes almost green right after bottling/kegging, but 6 months aging in a wine cellar & the edge comes off while the flavor develops.  Past that, you don't gain a ton and eventually start to lose some flavors.  The stuff I'm gifting in the next couple of months is between 6 and 10 months old.  I generally run big batches at the start of the year with a mindset toward having it ready for the holiday season.  You can also throw a pound or two of Amber DME into a 5 gallon batch for an easy bump to alcohol % that also gives it a bit darker complexion without heavily altering the taste.
 
If you add the DME, you should treat your juice like a wort and give it a proper boil.  That will extract more of what the juice and any added spices have to offer, but it also sets the pectin and you'll end up with a heavy haze that may or may not drop clear.  This harms nothing and can be mitigated.  If you're using pasteurized juice, there's zero harm in running a boil because they already did the damage.  Put an appropriate amount of pectic enzyme into your wort prior to fermentation to help extract more of the fruit characteristics and to help drop the pectin out of suspension.  Cold crash the final product before bottling if you want to get relatively clear cider in the end.  Cheers.
 
EDIT:  If you sulfite your cider before pitching (to prevent wild fermentation when using unpasteurized or pressed juice you do not want to boil), do not add the pectic enzyme until you actually add the yeast.  SO2 in heavy concentration prevents it from doing its work.
 
 
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