Would a pond/fountain pump work as well? I work at Lowe's so I could probably get one of those for a pretty good price. What exactly is an air stone, by the way? What purpose does it serve and how would I go about buying/making one?ColdSmoke said:
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tutorial Beginner's guide to AACT/Compost Tea
- Thread starter bigbodybussey
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You absolutely DO NOT need an air stone to brew tea. Dissolved oxygen is introduced to the solution the LEAST effectively by way of an air stone. (it's just a cheap and simple way)ColdSmoke said:
One can actually get just as good (or better) of a tea by using a pump that recirculates water from top to bottom. The surface agitation will introduce oxygen, and the longer the "loop" you put in your recirculation line, the better the oxygen will be infused into the solution. Of course, above a certain temperature, the ability to hold DO is limited, if not negated.
If I had to use a pump, and didn't trust a lack of bubbles, then a simple venturi will restore your faith in all things visible. Keep your return tube long, and give the oxygen a chance to itegrate on the trip...
Troll-onColdSmoke said:
He's entitled to his opinion and he may be correct but I use two good airstones and my tea has always done a good job so it's obviously aerobic.ColdSmoke said:
I haven't even brewed AACT this season except for once to wet my soil to get the colonies growing in the soil as it cycled for a month prior to planting.
Proud Marine Dad said:
It's not opinion, and I didn't think that I used foreign words when I said it.
Clarity - the person that I replied to, stated, as an authoritative fact - that an airstone MUST be used to brew tea. There was never an argument that airstones COULD NOT be used. They can. It's cheap, and it's effective. It's not rocket science. However, air bubbles traveling up the water column of a 5 gallon bucket are hardly the most efficient way to oxygenate anything. IF somebody should want to use a pump to brew tea, the bubble brewers should not try to dissuade them. My local grow shop brews 55 gallons at a time with nothing more than recirculation. I use a powerhead with a homemade venturi.
Oxygen takes time to dissolve into a liquid. Pressurizing it helps. We don't have to get that fancy, of course. But if somebody has equipment on hand, use it, FFS!
Point being - don't make this overly difficult. Don't tell a newbie that pump doesn't work. Waterfalls work, pumps work, venturis work, airstones work. Know what you're telling people before you state it as the word of the Lord.
That's all.
ColdSmoke
Extreme Member
ColdSmoke said:
Here is the comment: not really worthy of your scorn in my opinion, especially since "or something of the sort" is included.
Apologies for being grumpy about it, I just genuinely didn't understand your perspective. Thanks for the follow up information. Food for thought
Do you think that running air through the tubes without the stones would work better?
ColdSmoke said:
Not a big deal. I don't hold grudges, and it was forgotten almost the moment it went down.
As for your question - no I don't think tubes without stones work better - unless you use an inline venturi. (which I think is the best option for larger DIY tea brewers) You really want small bubbles. Small bubbles are absorbed easier than large ones. Small bubbles held in a volume of water for as long as possible before being allowed to break the surface, where any remaining oxygen will be lost to atmosphere - that's the best scenario.
That all makes for some good conversation - but make no mistake - no matter how inefficient your brewing mechanism - it's probably still going to be more than capable for the typical 20 hour brew that so many of us use. A $10 pump with 2 big blue airstones in a 5 gallon bucket will get it done every single time.
Use what you have or what you can acquire cheaply.
Guru I asked Lumper/Coot on GCO and he said it's BS and is anaerobic. I don't know anyone who would know better so I will take his word for it.Pepper-Guru said:
Pepper-Guru
Extreme Member
True that. I don't buy products anymore anyway. Nothing beats making your own.
Proud Marine Dad said:Guru I asked Lumper/Coot on GCO and he said it's BS and is anaerobic. I don't know anyone who would know better so I will take his word for it.
Well seeing as someone knowledgeable in a topic said something I will nod and agree ... now where is my local cult leader .. and where can I sign up... sarcasm intended... seriously bacteria/fungal spores can be held in a dormant state in all walks of life ... so I have to ask why not in this circumstance? As pepper-guru said .. yeast ... completely alive ... however also dormant ... and when added to a food source becomes active and reproduces. Bacteria can be held in stasis for an extended period of time in many natural situations otherwise how does bacteria survive in the wild? I am not saying these products are anything yet ... but to outright dismiss them based on one persons opinion is to me more then a little foolhardy ... anyway as guru said ... only one way to find outProud Marine Dad said:Guru I asked Lumper/Coot on GCO and he said it's BS and is anaerobic. I don't know anyone who would know better so I will take his word for it.
Do some reading on biofilms ... it may just open some eyes about dormant aerobic/anaerobic microbes ...
A quick link
http://www.nature.com/scitable/knowledge/library/the-extracellular-bastions-of-bacteria-nbsp-a-100450088
Pepper-Guru
Extreme Member
The topic is far from settled. I can provide facts for both ends of the argument. As I stated, the truth of the matter is this: "Put your goggles on and dive in" 400x preferably, web cam and have an ID book handy! You'll need it!
The person I mentioned reads peer reviewed journals all the time and is a legend on many other forums so I will take his word. But go ahead and test it as Guru said and find out for yourself.Trippa said:
Well, it appears I may have opened a can of worms with my question lol my bad!
As far as the setup goes, I figure in terms of size it would only be one or two 5gal. buckets. I'm not sure if I am going to brew this season or if I am going to hold off until next season. Or I could possibly brew some in the winter for my OW's to give them a nice boost, I'm sure they'd appreciate it!
I do have another question about pumps (hopefully not as controversial this time). I'm having difficulty determining what kind of pump I need: does this pump need to pump out air, which then creates the bubbles that aerate the tea, or is the pump a submersible one that circulates water, in turn creating the bubbles and dissolving oxygen? Or, just to confuse me, could either type of pump be used? Is there some kind of diagram that can help me visualize the setup/process?
As far as the setup goes, I figure in terms of size it would only be one or two 5gal. buckets. I'm not sure if I am going to brew this season or if I am going to hold off until next season. Or I could possibly brew some in the winter for my OW's to give them a nice boost, I'm sure they'd appreciate it!
I do have another question about pumps (hopefully not as controversial this time). I'm having difficulty determining what kind of pump I need: does this pump need to pump out air, which then creates the bubbles that aerate the tea, or is the pump a submersible one that circulates water, in turn creating the bubbles and dissolving oxygen? Or, just to confuse me, could either type of pump be used? Is there some kind of diagram that can help me visualize the setup/process?
Just did a quick search of the net and ofund a couple of instructional videos that walk you through the steps to make a small 5 gal brewer for AACT
http://permaculturenews.org/2011/04/08/how-to-make-a-compost-tea-brewer-for-under-30/
here is another one, and at the bottom they have a very brief bit about using a airlift to create a vortex type action which may mix the AACT better than just the air stones alone.
http://buildasoil.com/blogs/news/8325607-diy-compost-tea-brewer-how-to-make-a-compost-tea-brewer-on-a-budget-under-50
Just a couple of ideas, as I use airstones and seem to get a good froth going on my mix.
http://permaculturenews.org/2011/04/08/how-to-make-a-compost-tea-brewer-for-under-30/
here is another one, and at the bottom they have a very brief bit about using a airlift to create a vortex type action which may mix the AACT better than just the air stones alone.
http://buildasoil.com/blogs/news/8325607-diy-compost-tea-brewer-how-to-make-a-compost-tea-brewer-on-a-budget-under-50
Just a couple of ideas, as I use airstones and seem to get a good froth going on my mix.
Google "RDWC Hydroponics". Same principles will apply for maximum oxygenation in a tea brewer. It's a deep subject, and it leads down a lot of paths, so don't get distracted. Most of it is really overkill, as brewing tea requires little thought. But I respect your right to indulge curiosity.sreinhard88 said: