Fatalii variation

[Spicegeist]

All the different colored Fataliis aside, the original yellow Fatalii is a classic.
 
The bhuts and nagas are often conveniently named to help with the diversity found in that group (Naga Morich, Dorset Naga, etc.).
 
Sometimes Fatalii variation between strains is subtle, but it can also be not-so-subtle in terms of pod length, ripe coloration, and production.  Has anyone come across any way to tell the different Fatallis apart?  Have you seen any named Fatalii strains?

 

[megahot]

Waiting for Nigel to chime in. Im sure he can shed some light on the subject! I tried a cream fatalii from coheed196. It was different than the rest. Ive noticed that different colored pods have different tastes. Peach seems to taste peachy, yellow is slightly citrusy. Etc. But I know you already know anyways

 

[ajijoe]

All the different colored Fataliis aside, the original yellow Fatalii is a classic.
 
The bhuts and nagas are often conveniently named to help with the diversity found in that group (Naga Morich, Dorset Naga, etc.).
 
Sometimes Fatalii variation between strains is subtle, but it can also be not-so-subtle in terms of pod length, ripe coloration, and production.  Has anyone come across any way to tell the different Fatallis apart?  Have you seen any named Fatalii strains?

yes actually i have
 
yellow
white
chocolate
i have seen the red but i dont have it in my collection, for the most part you correct the taste and look is compleatly different than the yellow and the yellow tastes the best of them all, the white one is right behind it , the chocolate was the worst and i never had the red but was told its not the greatest either, none of them look like the original with the exception of the red and there seems to be quite a bit of variation there too
 
thanks your friend Joe

 

[smileyguy697]

I never thought about it like that. Hmmm.. The only thing i know is I've never ran across any named strains except the different colors like the bhut jolokia for example. Red, yelow, peach, yada, yada..

 

[Pr0digal_son]

Good question if I am picking up on it correctly. You mean named strains of the yellow classic,like Sudanese Fatalii or something like that? The only version I have grown was from guru's mother, they turned that a light ochre or golden color,not sure the original source. Pods were both long and thin,and also put out the wedge shape too. Definite classic,no real good way to market it with a name change. Prolific and flavorful doesn't sell.

 

[Spicegeist]

Good question if I am picking up on it correctly. You mean named strains of the yellow classic,like Sudanese Fatalii or something like that? The only version I have grown was from guru's mother, they turned that a light ochre or golden color,not sure the original source. Pods were both long and thin,and also put out the wedge shape too. Definite classic,no real good way to market it with a name change. Prolific and flavorful doesn't sell.
 

 
 
Yes, exactly.  I am talking about yellow Fatalii only.  There are a number of very different peppers which all go by the same name, so if someone gets some "Fatalii" seed they could turn out short, fat, orange, and take forever to ripen, or they could turn out long, narrow, and truly yellow, etc..

 

[ajijoe]

 
 
Yes, exactly.  I am talking about yellow Fatalii only.  There are a number of very different peppers which all go by the same name, so if someone gets some "Fatalii" seed they could turn out short, fat, orange, and take forever to ripen, or they could turn out long, narrow, and truly yellow, etc..

ok i was not aware there where variations within the yellow itself
i have very limited knowledge of the fatalii but it is a wonderful tasting pepepr no doubt!
you learn something new every day
 
thanks your friend Joe

 

[Burning Colon]

so i got these yellow fatalii and orange variant peppers. i would challenge the orange against barackpore or duoglah or other 7 pots. they are hot and i mean burn your face hot. since i have both and have tried them side by side.
 
but............. all of a sudden, after 3 years, my orange fatalii has decided to produce yellow pods. no shit. for 3 years i got these killer orange pods and all of a sudden yellows. no idea why!
 
and no the yellow is not as hot.

 

[KiNGDeNNiZ]

my nursery bought fatalii seemed to have crossed ... taste was exactly the same to the regular fatalii



notice the matte finish on some of them






even have one the shot a few round pods.. heat and taste remained consistent

More normal.

 

[rhm3769]

I'm sure the variations I'm seeing on my yellow olant is more from a change in temps after it starting fruiting.... ill see if I can get pictures up soon.... some are longer and some aee short and have what wants to be tails....

 

[ms1476]

I was not aware of multiple variations of yellow fatalii, guess I will have some more seeds to add to my grow list. I had one of my yellows turn out to be a red last season. The red tasted like red brains in my opinion...not good. It is my understanding that the red, as a mutant, may or may not present as red next season. It was amazing how it tasted completely different from the yellow, which I absolutely love. There was no citrus or sweet notes at all to my red fatalii. Definitely gonna be keeping an eye out for different types of the yellow.

 

[Datil]

I'm not a Fatalii expert by no means, but i suppose that there are a  LOT of OP Fatalii seeds flying around because in every thread about best tasting pepper it always gets an unanimous consensus... hence the variation.
Probably you'd better get some from someone growing it isolated from some years or take a cutting from a satisfaying exemplar if you want to be sure to grow the original heirloom.
 
Cya
 
Datil

 

[Pr0digal_son]

I'd imagine some Bonda ma Jacques get mixed in or some of the longer yellow habs.

 

[Spicegeist]

I'm not a Fatalii expert by no means, but i suppose that there are a  LOT of OP Fatalii seeds flying around because in every thread about best tasting pepper it always gets an unanimous consensus... hence the variation.
Probably you'd better get some from someone growing it isolated from some years or take a cutting from a satisfaying exemplar if you want to be sure to grow the original heirloom.
 
Cya
 
Datil

 
I was reading about the origin of the "Bengle Naga" the other day, and apparently it appeared amongst a large grow-out of regular classic bhuts.  I'm sure, with all the people growing Fatalii, there are some interesting strains floating around.
 
I'm excited to grow one out next year from "Spicy Chicken" who's been growing these out in Wisconsin:

 

[Nigel]

Firstly, I grew 4 yellow Fatalii plants this year and all conformed to the same, expected type, by look and taste (i.e. not scientifically). I have also had Yellow Fataliis from at least 5 other growers across the USA that I would describe as being so similar I could not tell them apart. I also grew 2 red Fatalii plants and those looked extremely similar in size, shape and growth habit to the yellow variety. The flavor was similar, but they were hotter than any of the Yellow ones grown 6 feet away. 
 
It would certainly be interesting to compare yellow Fataliis with different phenotypes. However, what I would ask is how do we tell different, naturally occurring phenotypes from crosses? Datil makes a very good point. 
 
It is entirely possible that what we are seeing is some sort of genetic drift, in that what we all grew in 2005 as Fatalii, isn`t quite the same anymore, due to hybridisation that does`t make much difference in phenotype, but over a few years starts to change the pepper fundamentally, albeit slowly. This sort of genetic drift is fairly common phenomenon and in the chili growing world, the sharing of OP seeds may possibly add a faster pace to the changes.
 
I am in no way being critical here, just trying to make a simple point. Unless an effort is made to maintain Landrace varieties in isolation, producing isolated seed, many will be lost forever in their original form. 

 

[Spicegeist]

Firstly, I grew 4 yellow Fatalii plants this year and all conformed to the same, expected type, by look and taste (i.e. not scientifically). I have also had Yellow Fataliis from at least 5 other growers across the USA that I would describe as being so similar I could not tell them apart. I also grew 2 red Fatalii plants and those looked extremely similar in size, shape and growth habit to the yellow variety. The flavor was similar, but they were hotter than any of the Yellow ones grown 6 feet away. 
 
It would certainly be interesting to compare yellow Fataliis with different phenotypes. However, what I would ask is how do we tell different, naturally occurring phenotypes from crosses? Datil makes a very good point. 
 
It is entirely possible that what we are seeing is some sort of genetic drift, in that what we all grew in 2005 as Fatalii, isn`t quite the same anymore, due to hybridisation that does`t make much difference in phenotype, but over a few years starts to change the pepper fundamentally, albeit slowly. This sort of genetic drift is fairly common phenomenon and in the chili growing world, the sharing of OP seeds may possibly add a faster pace to the changes.
 
I am in no way being critical here, just trying to make a simple point. Unless an effort is made to maintain Landrace varieties in isolation, producing isolated seed, many will be lost forever in their original form. 

 
From generation to generation there will be changes, sometimes subtle, somtimes not so subtle, even without the introduction of genes from other varieties.  The more plants you grow out, the higher the likelihood of spotting an anomaly, sometimes that can be exciting, for instance a plant that produces more or has a different kind of pod shape.  I'm more curious about some of these selections over the years, as the Fatalii continues to evolve and undergo selection in a number of different settings.  It seems we know more about bhuts and nagas and all their variations, but not a whole lot about the Fatalli.  My assumption is that as many people grow out the Fatalii, we should see the same kind of thing happening... like a Dorset Fatalii et cetera.

 

[Nigel]

 
From generation to generation there will be changes, sometimes subtle, somtimes not so subtle, even without the introduction of genes from other varieties.  The more plants you grow out, the higher the likelihood of spotting an anomaly, sometimes that can be exciting, for instance a plant that produces more or has a different kind of pod shape.  I'm more curious about some of these selections over the years, as the Fatalii continues to evolve and undergo selection in a number of different settings.  It seems we know more about bhuts and nagas and all their variations, but not a whole lot about the Fatalli.  My assumption is that as many people grow out the Fatalii, we should see the same kind of thing happening... like a Dorset Fatalii et cetera.

I completely agree with you, changes can indeed be picked up that way. No question that`s 100% right. All I`m saying is that it`s impossible to tell which route any changes result from. 
 
Has anyone ever brought Fatalii seeds back from Africa in the last few years? Just wondering.

 

[Spicegeist]

I completely agree with you, changes can indeed be picked up that way. No question that`s 100% right. All I`m saying is that it`s impossible to tell which route any changes result from. 
 
Has anyone ever brought Fatalii seeds back from Africa in the last few years? Just wondering.

 
PeriPeri bought some Fataliis in a market in South Africa...

 

[PeriPeri]

lol Guilty as charged! The Ftalaii's I grew last season were bang on. Acid Yellow, gnarly and hot... that musk, citrus and banoffee flavour is unmistakeable. I did notice that compared to the Fatalii's I was growing, a lot of northern hemisphere Fataliis were much less gnarly. I can imagine that temperature has a factor to play in this too. Lower temps yield smaller and smoother pods of course. I am doing a study on the humble PeriPeri here in southern africa. I am collecting PeriPeri seeds from all the countries around South Africa to see their variations. The origins of the PeriPeri being Angola and Mozambique. This year I am growing PeriPeri from South Africa, Mozambique, Malawi and Zimbabwe.... can't wait to see the similarities/differences!