lighting Flower drop and lighting

[R1dreamer]

I have had an inner turmoil for months trying to decide which route to take..... I intend on making a new larger grow box for super hots. Roughly 3' x 3'. I will be going DWC for sure but I am undecided on the lighting. I previously had a California Lightworks 220 watt full spectrum LED over 2 cayenne and 2 reapers in a roughly 2' x 18" box in DWC. All plants had explosive growth and the cayennes dumped a bunch of peppers but I had a terrible bout with flower drop with the 2 reapers. Both reapers made bunches of flowers but not one of them set. I was hand pollinating as well.
 
Looking back, I didn't switched my nutrients over to bloom phase at all and I'm pretty sure peppers like cayenne's and jalapenos are far less finicky than super hots.
 
Would it be safe to say that.. since both reapers pushed out tonnes of flowers but none took, my flower drop problem can be completely due to my lack of care in DWC nutrients?
 
In this case, I would consider another LED.
 
The draw to HPS for me is that this light is so tried and tested, it is definitely not the lights fault if something doesn't work out.
 
That 315 CMH looks awesome as well.
 
Please help!

 

[smokemaster]

HEAT or Lack there of caused me to get Flower drop in my Hydro setup.
Galopagoense didn't like heat where Chinense loved it etc.
BUT I've had problems with Reapers,the early stuff that was sold at first.
I think they were not stable yet etc.
Lighting hasn't been a problem,but I grow on shelves/wire rack type,Kitchen stuff.
 
My grow area is usually too hot rather than cold-no ventilation/windows.
 
Nutes,for me just gave me a ton of buds or less buds.
I don't think drop was due to general nutes or Light FOR MY GROW.
IF you have great looking plants,I'd guess it's a temp. problem.
 
I only change nutes outside in soil-potting mix gets used up,My plants tell me what they need in my pots.
I use Fish Emultion(alaska) and seaweed extract with my witches brew outside.
I don't measure anything,I just pour close to what looks like I used when I did measure stuff out.
In Hydro I do semi measure stuff out though.
 
The only nute exception might be a lack of Calcium in Hydro or?
 
I add Dolomite lime to Vinegar and add it to both indoor and outdoor plants.
 
No formula-just add Vingar to lime(or calcium source),what gets turned into Calcium Acetate works.
If you can find Foli Cal,it is what you can buy.EXPENSIVE!
I think since Dolomite lime contains both Mag. and Ca.,I get a better nute.
I just know what works for me,only,maybe not you...
 
My 5Gal. home made Hydro setups work fine.I don't check PH anymore,my water is cool PH out of the tap(I let it sit a day+ to get rid of Chlorine/Chloramine etc.).
I change water every week,use it outside in my pots...Waste not want not. LOL
A side note about why I don't use Mag.(Epsom salts) is because the plant uses both Ca. and Mag. with the same receptors/whatever.
Fill the receptor with either,and it can't get the other.
 
It seems that Witches brew is FOR ME the best,EVEN source of both.
 
Peppers can and will grow ,bud etc. under red only or Blue only light.
I'm sure of that,possitively!
Red LEDS put out short hedges in 4 1/2 inch pots,Blue in the same sized pots put out bigger plants with the same branching etc.
I prefer putting small hedges out side once I get a few pure pods indoors.
I make my own LED light panels.
Have for years...
 
Plants want-are designed to grow.
Try witches brew.
Google CMPMANS posts and others that we talk about Witches brew.
GW,was,I think where we talked a LOT about it.
I named it Witches brew,I read on Tomato forums,years ago about it.
Tried it and it works for me.
 
Several other posts are out there.
 
http://forums.gardenweb.com/discussions/2083699/smokemasters-witches-brew-revisted-as-seen-by-a-nerd
 
 
https://www.google.com/search?espv=2&q=Smokemasters+witches+brew+recipe+for+plants&oq=Smokemasters+witches+brew+recipe+for+plants&gs_l=serp.3...14089.23218.0.26672.13.13.0.0.0.0.125.1466.1j12.13.0....0...1c.1.64.serp..1.12.1368.zuzYS2HiHdk
 
Hope it helps...
 
Smoke

 

[R1dreamer]

Wow. Thanks a bunch for the info!

 

[willard3]

Flower drop probable causes:
 
1. Day temp too high >95F
2. Night temp too low <65F or too high >85F
3. Too much nitrogen fertilizer
4. Too much water
5. Low light levels (reduces fertility).
6. Very low humidity (reduces fertility)
7. Poor air circulation (air circulation contributes to pollination).
8. Lack of pollinating insects.
9. Size of pot
10. Too much mineral in feedwater.
11. Too much grower attention/anxiety.

 

[MarianneW]

Flower drop probable causes:
 
1. Day temp too high >95F
2. Night temp too low <65F or too high >85F
3. Too much nitrogen fertilizer
4. Too much water
5. Low light levels (reduces fertility).
6. Very low humidity (reduces fertility)
7. Poor air circulation (air circulation contributes to pollination).
8. Lack of pollinating insects.
9. Size of pot
10. Too much mineral in feedwater.
11. Too much grower attention/anxiety.

This list is just wrong. Number 1 and 2 are not true. Each variety has their own temperature range that they want to get in. 95 to 65 f is good for my Christmas Bells but my Peru Yellow hates that range and won't set a pod. It wants temps in the low 50s. Instead of looking at your plants and assuming that since it is 85 in your grow it is the right temp, look into what the actual plant wants.

I've never had blossom drop from numbers 4 and 5. My humidity gets down to 3% or so with no damage to the plants. Right now my UV index is 1-2 and I grow in the shade and I've got a variety of plants putting out buds like crazy. I monitor my sun intensity via my real time solar reporting rig on my house and have noticed no correlation between intensity and pod set. Instead temp is a major determinate. If it's got enough light to live and grow, it has enough light to set pods.

Too much mineral in water should say too much salt in water.

It's important to actually test these so-called rules that keep getting posted. They're frequently not very good advice.

OP, the important part of getting pods to set is to look into what the ideal growing conditions for your particular plant is. Like Smoke says, one of his plants wants it cool, the others want it hot. There's a lot of variability between ideal growing conditions for different varieties and replicating those conditions leads to good success for pod set.

 

[Jase4224]

This list is just wrong. Number 1 and 2 are not true. Each variety has their own temperature range that they want to get in. 95 to 65 f is good for my Christmas Bells but my Peru Yellow hates that range and won't set a pod. It wants temps in the low 50s. Instead of looking at your plants and assuming that since it is 85 in your grow it is the right temp, look into what the actual plant wants.

I've never had blossom drop from numbers 4 and 5. My humidity gets down to 3% or so with no damage to the plants. Right now my UV index is 1-2 and I grow in the shade and I've got a variety of plants putting out buds like crazy. I monitor my sun intensity via my real time solar reporting rig on my house and have noticed no correlation between intensity and pod set. Instead temp is a major determinate. If it's got enough light to live and grow, it has enough light to set pods.

Too much mineral in water should say too much salt in water.

It's important to actually test these so-called rules that keep getting posted. They're frequently not very good advice.

OP, the important part of getting pods to set is to look into what the ideal growing conditions for your particular plant is. Like Smoke says, one of his plants wants it cool, the others want it hot. There's a lot of variability between ideal growing conditions for different varieties and replicating those conditions leads to good success for pod set.

This post has really cleared a few things up for me personally. I've had fruit set issues myself and couldn't figure out exactly why (I have been using the above list).

Now that I DO have my chinenses setting fruit I believe I had too much nitrogen/nutrients in my pots..

When I potted them up I put manure as part of my recipe which I think is fine but then overdid it by adding dynamic lifter AND osmocote. As well as liquid feeding once a week.. So there I was worried about how many hours of light they were getting thinking this was the cause. When I thaught about Nitrogen I went and gave my plants a good water, stopped the liquid feeding and but them back down the side of the house where they get less light (and where my wife wants them!). Within a week I have had fruit set on multiple varieties.

Don't mean to hijack the thread but I've struggled with fruit set for a long time and now I think I've got it right thanks to threads like this so I hope my experience might help someone else.

 

[R1dreamer]

Thanks so much for the input guys!! I'm starting to think that I had 2 problems with setting fruit in the DWC (very similar to Jase).
 
1. Too much nitrogen. I had my nutes set for veg / growth which was very nitrogen heavy and never switched over to bloom.
2. Too much nutrients period! I was way up into 12 and 1300 PPM. That's more for tomato or weed (i'm assuming). I'm going to keep it down to 600 to 700 PPM and heavier ratio of P and K to N.

 

[SvtCobra]

I had the same problem with my Indian Carbon under LED lighting. Problem turned out to be a bout with aphids, temp was too hot and soil had too much Nitrogen. I re potted in lower N soil. Gave the plant some high phosphorus guano and reduced the grow room temp and started getting pods. I noticed though that some flowers where not putting out much pollen. Check your flowers to see how much pollen production your getting. My peppers are under Mars Hydro lights.

 

[smokemaster]

Nitrogen and Peppers has been proven VERY wrong lately.
 
Check out some of the national sites about CROP propagation for peppers.
 
Last I read was the whole thing about nutes is proving wrong.\
 
Ends up plants use what they need at any time.
Doesn't matter what you overdose them on.
Plant receptors are what they are.
Overdose a plant with MAG. and you get a Ca. problem.
The Ca. receptors are the same ones that deal with Mag.
Once full of either-it doesn't matter if 1 is needed over the other,the receptors are full for those nutes...
 
It's not good to treat a Plant with un balanced nutes - as for buds,growth etc.
 
They found out,it seems,that if you are growing most anything for food/a Crop,you get less product by neglecting certain nutes to get instant buds/lots of buds.
The plant can only support X fruits.
SO in the long run,you can get SOME plants to bud like crazy withholding nutes.
But a plant only is geared to survival-fruiting viable seeds and fruit.
 
I think I saw on CARDI that high nitrogen ferts on peppers actually put out more pods all season long.
 
I used to do the high Nitrogen thing and none or little at budding-or to encourage budding.
Didn't get more pods...
Just lots of buds that didn't set,or a ton of small pods on a FEW plants.
 
Light ,I think could be a problem-maybe.
 
I always go on the side of compairing LUX to the sun at noon(something like 35,000lux?)
My shelves always exceeded  the LUX of the sun.50,000 + LUX or so...
My lighting has always had a higher LUX.
I try to use ALL Plant usable light too.
 
I use the meter I have-Par values etc. aren't of concern with most lighting(Vendors lie and unless you have a spectrometer,you have no clue as to what your light source is in reality.Compared to other similar light sources.)
 
ALSO a BIG thing is that I only want small hedges in 4 1/2 in. pots for seed,then they go outside.
I KNOW a TOTAL INDOOR GROW IS A LOT DIFFERENT.
 
My way MIGHT work IF you wanted a crop of Bonzi plants.
18 X 48 X 20 inch shelves are a different thing,so are grow tents.
My grow IS different than yours....