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maxcaps 2014 grow: avoiding the freeze!

Hello All,
 
New here, but feeling right at home. I figured I'd go ahead and get my glog started, though I may wait a few weeks yet before starting anything.
 
I'm pretty new, not totally new. I had a small grow last year, mostly in containers, bringing up plants that I hoped would make cool overwinter bonsai's (bonchi's). I ordered a handful of different varieties from http://fataliiseeds.net, all  95% of which sprouted nicely, though something must have gone wrong because many never grew true leaves. I think my house was too cold... I've moved now and now have an excellent heating system. I also kept the seeds by a window that I think got too drafty. 
 
I did have a handful of chinenses survive, including a wonderful Red Habanero from fataliiseeds, and some chiero roxa plants that produced a handful of tasty purple pods. I purchased some local Scotch Bonnett starts from a small scale nursery, and grew jalapeños and serrano starts from a local nursery. It's safe to say I am now addicted, as all these fire worked its way into my family's weekly diet. I have a 12'X8' plot begging for plants, and I may do some extra in containers...
 
Enough background. Here's the plan. As jalapeños (salsa, roasted, and canned) are not a staple, I want to grow a handful of varieties. The chinenses have amazing flavors, so I'm going to branch out with two or three new varieties (though sadly I did not save any scotch bonnet seeds from the last season... what is wrong with me?). Last year I tried some super hot varieties... none lived. I am going to try again! I actually ordered most of these seeds before stumbling upon this wonderful community. In any event, here is the lineup:
 
Chinenses:
 
Red Habanero (seeds kept and OW bonchi (thanks fatalii)
Chiero Roxa (seeds kept, may use OW bonchi, haven't decided)
Scotch Bonnett (forgot to keep seeds, but I can replant OW bonchi)
White Habanero (seeds from Pepper Joe, should arrive soon...)
Chocolate Habanero (seeds from Pepper Joe, should also arrive soon)
Fatali (from pepperlover.com)
Big Sun Habernero (from pepperlover)
 
Superhot Chinenses:
 
Carolina Reaper (seeds from PuckerButt)
Naga Morich (seeds from PuckerButt)
Bhut Jolokia (seeds from PuckerButt)
Dorset Naga (seeds from PuckerButt)
7 pod (from pepperlover.com)
 
Other Superhot:
 
Tiepin (seeds from PuckerButt)
 
Annuums:
 
Poblanos (from Pepper Joe... growing to Acho's to use as powder base)
Giant Jalapeño (from Pepper Joe)
Early Jalapeño (from Pepper Joe)
Black Jalapeño (from Pepper Joe)
Purple Jalapeño (from Pepper Joe)
Fresno Pepper (from Pepper Joe)
 
Wish I had found you guys sooner, I'd have added some douglah's to the list. I am also on the fence about adding a couple more chinense varieties. 
 
Also growing some companions. Planning on putting in a couple tomato plants, garlic, cilantro, and carrots (had a lot of luck with tasty fat purple carrots... atomic purple I think they were called)
 
Will post some picks of my OW bonchi's tomorrow, and start going into techniques. On the fence about coffee-filter germination versus sowing in a tray.
 
Click to expand...
Sadly some of the clones dropped their flowers. No fruit set yet. Probably for the best, as they are still very small. Still, it'd be interesting to get a pod or two before the springtime, just to see if it can be done!
 
The Red Hab bonchi is putting on a ton of buds, but a couple have turned brown on the tips. There is a little browning on the tips of a couple leaves as well... probably a stress-infection from the copious amounts of dish soap I've had to use to get aphids under control. Luckily the aphids seem to be out of the picture now. Will post some pics soon!
 
Everything is looking good Maxcap, but if I were you, I would pull out all of the chinense plants from your square foot garden and put them into 7-10 gallon pots. They really really stretch out and need more room. With healthy soil, you should have no problem getting a plant that is 5' tall and 4'+ across. Check some of the glogs from Aug this year and see how big other members chinense plants get.
 
The annuums and others will be fine, but a little crowded at 12" spacing. Personally, my annuum garden will be 16" centers.
 
Jeff H said:
Everything is looking good Maxcap, but if I were you, I would pull out all of the chinense plants from your square foot garden and put them into 7-10 gallon pots. They really really stretch out and need more room. With healthy soil, you should have no problem getting a plant that is 5' tall and 4'+ across. Check some of the glogs from Aug this year and see how big other members chinense plants get.
 
The annuums and others will be fine, but a little crowded at 12" spacing. Personally, my annuum garden will be 16" centers.
Click to expand...
 
Yeah I may have to reduce the numbers a bit. Also I may double the space, if they give me the plot. Unfortunately I don't have any space for pots unless I place a few around the raised bed. I'm working in a community garden and I live in a top floor apartment. Sadly, no roof space.
 
Some of this is going to have to depend on what germinates and survives to go outside. Just trying to get a rough idea of what I have space for.
 
EDIT
 
Any particular varieties you think will hit those big sizes? I could go down to one plant per variety, trying to couch my risk though!
 
maximumcapsicum said:
 
Alright, question time, how many seedlings do you recommend to shoot for per final garden plant? Think I should sow the seeds in individual cells then transplant them, or stick 3 seeds or so in solo cups from the start and snip the weakest links? Share with me your wisdom, THP chili heads!
Click to expand...
stickman said:
You can snip the extras anytime, but if the plan is to prick them out and replant in a pot of their own, I let them grow a set of true leaves first and handle by the cotys only. If you pinch the stem it's game over, and pinching the true leaves is a pretty severe setback when the seedlings are this small. They're gonna shed the cotys anyway, so they're expendable.
Click to expand...
Nice grow list MC
 
Hi Adam,
   Looking good so far with the OW plants. Don't worry about dropped flowers or the first oddly-shaped or undersize pods... it all straightens out when the days warm up and lengthen. You've got an ambitious grow planned with a lot of great varieties. If you've got good garden soil, I agree with Jeff... 16 inch spacing might be better, but you can probably get away with 12 if you prune the lower branches to let in more light and air. Some varieties get pretty big in just one season... Poblanos, Marconis, and most Ajis would need more like 26 to 32 inch spacing... you need to research the varieties when planning your garden space. Good luck in 2014, and have a happy holiday!
 
stickman said:
Hi Adam,
   Looking good so far with the OW plants. Don't worry about dropped flowers or the first oddly-shaped or undersize pods... it all straightens out when the days warm up and lengthen. You've got an ambitious grow planned with a lot of great varieties. If you've got good garden soil, I agree with Jeff... 16 inch spacing might be better, but you can probably get away with 12 if you prune the lower branches to let in more light and air. Some varieties get pretty big in just one season... Poblanos, Marconis, and most Ajis would need more like 26 to 32 inch spacing... you need to research the varieties when planning your garden space. Good luck in 2014, and have a happy holiday!
Click to expand...
 
I tend to be a pretty active pruner, especially with those lower branches where infections can set in. None of my chinenses got more than 3x2' last year but I had some challenges and I actually chocked it up to the containers I was growing in. The annuums actually got much bigger than the chinenses. The 12' spacing I actually got from DeWitt's book on growing peppers, but he said some other odd things about growing them as close as 8". I am starting some serious soil therapy in January, adding in a ton of compost and pulling out some big chunks of old mulch that the community garden mixed in for some reason. Still, not one to turn down wisdom, now I am thinking of something more like this:
 

 
Basically dropping it to one plant per chinense variety and staggering the annuums between them. If I go this route i will probably shoot for one less Roxa (probably just plant a bonsai... bet I can get a pretty thick trunk during a second season.
 
The next caveat... they may give me a second plot, which will considerably open my options.
 
maximumcapsicum said:
 
Yeah I may have to reduce the numbers a bit. Also I may double the space, if they give me the plot. Unfortunately I don't have any space for pots unless I place a few around the raised bed. I'm working in a community garden and I live in a top floor apartment. Sadly, no roof space.
 
Some of this is going to have to depend on what germinates and survives to go outside. Just trying to get a rough idea of what I have space for.
 
EDIT
 
Any particular varieties you think will hit those big sizes? I could go down to one plant per variety, trying to couch my risk though!
Click to expand...
 
Take a look at this post. 2nd pic. That is a 4'x4' sq.ft. garden with 16 chinense plants. That is what you can expect with good soil.
 
http://thehotpepper.com/topic/36243-joynershotpeppers-2013-glog/?p=886644
You'd have to ask Chris how the interior plants turned out, but I can only imagine they were choked out or at least stifled.
 
Jeff H said:
 
Take a look at this post. 2nd pic. That is a 4'x4' sq.ft. garden with 16 chinense plants. That is what you can expect with good soil.
 
http://thehotpepper.com/topic/36243-joynershotpeppers-2013-glog/?p=886644

You'd have to ask Chris how the interior plants turned out, but I can only imagine they were choked out or at least stifled.
Click to expand...
 
Wow Jeff, thanks for the lead! I have a lot to think about for sure. It's not a true "square foot garden" because my soil isn't going to be that nice. Fines and organic compost mostly, and I'll mulch the plants after I get them in the ground. I am thinking about fertilizing routines as well, probably fish emulsion and/or bone and blood meal. That or I may just used an organic tomato tone. I've been testing a lot of products, heh. If I am half so blessed as Chris I'll be a happy camper, but it does look like one of the interior plants may have stifled a bit. I may also be a bit shaded by neighboring plots.
 
What did you think of the second layout I posted, dropping to one of each chinense and giving them a lot more space but crowing the annuums a little bit? 
 
Hi Adam,
 
I have to agree with Jeff, and what he's saying about the spacing...
 
Here's a pic of my grow, 3' spacing between rows and plants http://www.devtex.net/images/816.jpg during the 2013 season. I had no idea they would get that big. Have a look at Jason's glog (Ga GrowHead), he's in Ga. too.
 
Next year 5' between rows and 4' between any Chinense, those in the pic are Reapers, and Hab's mainly. To the left are some Annuum's.
 
Even if you decide to plant closer, I'm sure you will get many peppers, just so hard to manage. I couldn't even get in to pick...and then finding rattle snakes....
 
I've been a one seed per pellet guy, now at three. Precious time is lost for failed germination.
 
BTW, nice seed selection!
 
Devv said:
Hi Adam,
 
I have to agree with Jeff, and what he's saying about the spacing...
 
Here's a pic of my grow, 3' spacing between rows and plants http://www.devtex.net/images/816.jpg during the 2013 season. I had no idea they would get that big. Have a look at Jason's glog (Ga GrowHead), he's in Ga. too.
 
Next year 5' between rows and 4' between any Chinense, those in the pic are Reapers, and Hab's mainly. To the left are some Annuum's.
 
Even if you decide to plant closer, I'm sure you will get many peppers, just so hard to manage. I couldn't even get in to pick...and then finding rattle snakes....
 
I've been a one seed per pellet guy, now at three. Precious time is lost for failed germination.
 
BTW, nice seed selection!
Click to expand...
 
Jeff H and Devv and Stickman: Thanks for the wonderful advice! 
 
My chinenses didn't get nearly as big as the ones in your photos, but I know they were stunted a little bit by earwigs and smallish pots. Earwigs were really bad actually... they munched new growth. After it got warm enough and the plants strong enough, the earwig population tapered out, the plants got much stronger and I got a smallish crop of habs and the addiction set in. I live in a new place now, and have the raised beds to work with, but I think the soil is going to need some work... it's got way too many big chunks of wood in it, I think from poorly chopped mulch. That is a project for later.
 
So yeah, I'll dial it down to one for each of the species I'm growing, except maybe the roxas. And I'm going to try to double my growing space as well. 
 
Thanks again guys, and will keep you in the loop!
 
All right Max - forging ahead!  Way to go.
 
You will be amazed by how big some of the chilli plants
will get in your amended soil.  Put the bone meal in a couple
of months before plant out so it has time to break down to a
form available to the roots.
 
I like Alaska fish Fertilizer NPK ratio 5:1:1 for the beginning stages
of my plants growth cycle.  Then when they are ready for Spring/Summer
flowering, I also add some Mor-Bloom NPK 0:10:10 for budding and blooming.  
There are lots of products on the market similar to these, but these are pretty
readily available.
 
You might also try something with mychorrizae in it, or getting a bag of some.  
I like Earth Juice Rainbow Mix.  Sprinkle a good shot in with each transplant,
and it interacts with the roots to make nutrients available to the plants.
 
PaulG said:
All right Max - forging ahead!  Way to go.
 
You will be amazed by how big some of the chilli plants
will get in your amended soil.  Put the bone meal in a couple
of months before plant out so it has time to break down to a
form available to the roots.
 
I like Alaska fish Fertilizer NPK ratio 5:1:1 for the beginning stages
of my plants growth cycle.  Then when they are ready for Spring/Summer
flowering, I also add some Mor-Bloom NPK 0:10:10 for budding and blooming.  
There are lots of products on the market similar to these, but these are pretty
readily available.
 
You might also try something with mychorrizae in it, or getting a bag of some.  
I like Earth Juice Rainbow Mix.  Sprinkle a good shot in with each transplant,
and it interacts with the roots to make nutrients available to the plants.
Click to expand...
 
Very useful info! I think the Alaska products count as organic, right? Mostly just ground up seaweed and fish. Yum.
 
I probably won't start working on the soil till mid January. I have kale and carrots going now... and garlic that I need to pull. Tasty stuff. I figure mid January I should start that.
 
Adam,
 
Ever consider a cover crop to OW the garden?
 
I have Crimson clover and rye growing now. To hold the nutes from leaching and add some, as well as the green manure when tilled in..
 
Devv said:
Adam,
 
Ever consider a cover crop to OW the garden?
 
I have Crimson clover and rye growing now. To hold the nutes from leaching and add some, as well as the green manure when tilled in..
Click to expand...
 
Not this year, still have kale, carrots, and garlic going for the time being. Some spinach too but it hasn't tasted too great. Not sure when I'm going to pull it all up and start working on the soil. Maybe mid January? Problem is the kale is producing so well I've just let it go. Looks nice too... all purple in the winter.
 
When I get a little more space I will definitely be running cover crops through the winter. 
 
Adam,

Enjoy the holidays and have a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year!

Scott


Wow Scott thanks! And the same to you and yours. You and everyone here at THP have been so welcoming... Though I haven't been here long, I am lookin to stay as long as I can!
 
I hope we get to follow and enjoy your grows for years to come!
 
Alright, most the family is heading out, and its time to do a little update.
 
The OW bonsai's are doing well I think. The ones in the back are doing much better than those in the front, I think because they are an inch or so taller and soaking up more of the light. The weakest one is the scotch bonnet, which has turned a little pale at the bottom and lost some leaves. I may put some mylar around them to help send more lumens to their bottom leaves, but its surviving. Not sure if I am going to plant it out this season any who. Alright, pics:
 

 
The strongest Roxa bonchi. Its extra inch or two of height seems to really be helping it out. It's actually going to need a haircut soon... debating on whether to go for more foliage or let it flower and maybe make a pod or two before the spring.
 

 
The one in back is a red hab, which gave some very tasty pods over the summer. It's extremely healthy as well, though its leaves have been browning just slightly at the tips. I think this was the result of too much dish soap in my battle against aphids. Luckily the battle seems to have been won, with the bonchis anyway.
 
The one in the front was the red scotch bonnet (actually after reading in THP a little while I'm not sure it was actually a bonnet.) It's struggling a little. Leaves are getting pale at the bottom and it isn't really growing anymore. I think it may need a bit more light and maybe some nutrients. Any ideas?
 

 
The other shorter bonchi. I was a bit concerned about it but I noticed its sending out a lot of sideshoots, so all seems to be well. Leaves do have some spots on them... maybe from stress.
 

 
The clones were going strong, but I had a lot of company over the holiday and wasn't as vigilant on my aphid patrols. Sadly they have returned, and one of the clones started to droop a little bit. I doused 'em with weak dish soap, which seemed to work pretty well with the bonchis. Gonna give them a good rinse in a day or so too... also seems to help, but I want them to dry out a little first.
 
The fam dropped one of these under my tree as well:
 

 
Very nice and thoughtful gift.  I used a similar flat last season and it was very hard to deal with roots that had grown through the drainage holes, damaging the little seedlings. Also it took forever to get true leaves on the sprouts, nearly a month, but I think the room I was growing in was too cold. I was leaning toward using jiffy pellets this year instead, since I can pop the seedlings into solo cups as soon as they germ. Still, I see beautiful shots you guys post of ~4" tall seedings thriving in these kinds of flats, and the bottom watering may help prevent damping off. What do you guys think? Any luck with one these guys? 
 
Thanks THP!
 
Hi Adam,
 
Very nice bonchi project you have there, my friend!
I tried it two years ago, just for the experience and to keep my girlfirend happy, and I found that it is harder to kill them than a normal bonsai, so it is worth to deal with them.
Nice Christmas present!
 
Balázs
 
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