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chinense Need help IDing these C.Chinense!

Hendrix1326

Hendrix1326

Hello, everyone! I was down in Texas a few weeks ago, and stopped in a Latin grocery store, where I found several types of peppers I'd never had before. One of those was a C.Chinense I got a couple of 'cause they caught my eye. They were labeled as "Mexican Habaneros", but they didn't look at all like "regular" orange Habs. Here is a link to an ID video I made on YouTube of them:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbM6wBP6ZjY&feature=youtu.be


Anyone who can ID these puppies it would be much appreciated. I searched Thechileman.org and narrowed it down (at least for the C.Chinense with pictures) to were CGN 22092 and PI 257176.
 
Shaped like Royal Gold.
But Royal Gold didn't grow that big for me.
Mine were Peach Colored.
But Royal gold is supposed to be from Peru I think.

IM004905.jpg
 
Are they perhaps an orange tazmanian habanero?

http://www.ethno-botanik.org/Capsicum/Habanero-Tasmanian-Red/Fotos/500/Habanero-Tasmanian-Red-35.jpg
 
They look freaking awesome! How did they taste is also important :) Could be Australian Lantern (but the pods of that variety aren't big), Lantern (CGN 20790) no idea on the size of the pods, currently growing this myself so hopefully I can tell you in a couple of months. It could also be a Scarlet Lantern (PI 315008)?
 
meatfreak said:
They look freaking awesome! How did they taste is also important :) Could be Australian Lantern (but the pods of that variety aren't big), Lantern (CGN 20790) no idea on the size of the pods, currently growing this myself so hopefully I can tell you in a couple of months. It could also be a Scarlet Lantern (PI 315008)?
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I know, right! That's what first drew me to them was the appearance. As far as flavor goes, they were pretty sweet, maybe faintly bitter in the background (WAAAAAY back there!), not really tart or acidic, a crisp clean Habanero-type flavor, but not as "musky" as traditional Habaneros, if that makes sense.


smokemaster said:
Shaped like Royal Gold.
But Royal Gold didn't grow that big for me.
Mine were Peach Colored.
But Royal gold is supposed to be from Peru I think.
Click to expand...

Wow, those look remarkably similar to mine. The grocer could have mislabeled them, or they could have come from Peruvian seedstock and grown in Mexico, then exported. Your picture really looks like the pods I got. I saved seeds from the one I tested today, and have one other that I will get the seeds from and add them to my seedbank for grow/trade/SASBE somewhere down the line.


jsschrstrcks said:
Are they perhaps an orange tazmanian habanero?

http://www.ethno-bot...nian-Red-35.jpg
Click to expand...


I thought of that, too, when I looked at them. I have Tasmanian Red seeds, and almost chose them for growing this year, but I guess they'll have to wait for another year! In any case, there is another strong possibility, because they are very similarly shaped pods.


Thanks for the input, guys!
Karl
 
Looks like a hybrid/cross of a habanero. Mexico only really has one C. chinense, and that is the habanero but these days I'm sure there are a lot of hybrid/crosses going around. In Mexico it would be illegal to call those pods habaneros since habs are a specific variety and shape, and are now protected under Mexican law
 
My guess is that these are some mutation or cross of a habanero. I can't imagine the grocer or supplier being wrong about their source. Neither have any reason to buy exotic/rare peppers and not market them. Especially those that look so similar to habs.

I have recently seen very similar shaped ones in one of our local groceries as well.
 
Eephus Man said:
My guess is that these are some mutation or cross of a habanero. I can't imagine the grocer or supplier being wrong about their source. Neither have any reason to buy exotic/rare peppers and not market them. Especially those that look so similar to habs.

I have recently seen very similar shaped ones in one of our local groceries as well.
Click to expand...


Grocers/suppliers sometimes buy from people who may have gotten the name of their pepper from someone who just arbitrarily named it, or used a local name that may not be recognized elsewhere. There are many names for types of peppers depending on the region you grow them in. Only here in the English-speaking world is there so much concern over "Official Names". People call them certain names based on their culture's customs, and when those same peppers get State-side, Europe-side, or Australia/New Zealand-side, we name them something different, although that being said, these days people want as authentic of a name as possible, to try and eliminate confusion.

Ultimately, what needs to be done is very specific genetic analysis on all varieties to see where the differences are, and come up with new classification systems for all species, without it becoming burdensome and over-complex.

I was not saying or implying that the grocer would intentionally do something of that sort, I was just saying that they may not have had all available information on this specific cultivar, and just labeled it in a general way, or whomever they bought them from done the same thing.
 
Hendrix1326 said:
Grocers/suppliers sometimes buy from people who may have gotten the name of their pepper from someone who just arbitrarily named it, or used a local name that may not be recognized elsewhere. There are many names for types of peppers depending on the region you grow them in. Only here in the English-speaking world is there so much concern over "Official Names". People call them certain names based on their culture's customs, and when those same peppers get State-side, Europe-side, or Australia/New Zealand-side, we name them something different, although that being said, these days people want as authentic of a name as possible, to try and eliminate confusion.

Ultimately, what needs to be done is very specific genetic analysis on all varieties to see where the differences are, and come up with new classification systems for all species, without it becoming burdensome and over-complex.

I was not saying or implying that the grocer would intentionally do something of that sort, I was just saying that they may not have had all available information on this specific cultivar, and just labeled it in a general way, or whomever they bought them from done the same thing.
Click to expand...

My point was not that it was a pure hab. It was that no supplier is going to accidentally sell an in-demand varietal without getting it right. My point was that the pepper is very likely not something from Tazmania, Australia or Peru if it ended up in the supply chain from a large Mexican grower in a well-known grocery store.

But obviously, I'm assuming those last two are the case.
 
It was a place called Fiesta market down in Plano, TX. I'm not sure how big of a chain it is. I wasn't implying at the beginning of my post that it was anything rare or in-demand, I only said that it didn't look like a traditional Habanero-type pepper, and was trying to figure out which kind it was.

On a side-note regarding whether it is from Tasmania, Australia or Peru, all peppers ultimately are related anyway, and with how many people worldwide love chilies, it is not unreasonable to assume that varieties from anywhere in the world could end up anywhere else if people are interested enough to branch out and get many kinds of seeds.

Case-in-point: TheHotPepper.com, where we Chiliheads unite on a common site from everywhere in the world, sending each other seeds and pods of thousands of varieties and growing them ourselves.

It isn't a far cry from this point to see how easily said seeds could be obtained from local farmers who know people in slightly bigger growing operations, and supply a big enough seed stock to those larger operations and grow a lot of peppers in a short time, thus enabling them to enter the larger supply chain of grocery chains within a couple of years time.

Also, to take into account how growing peppers in different regions of the world ultimately leads to mutations where new varieties are created everyday. Anyway, thanks for entering into this discussion with me, it allowed me to further explore possible avenues of investigation/explanation to enhance my own knowledge of peppers. Fun times!


Take it easy,
Karl
 
Still likely a habanero cross if they did indeed come from Mexico. They can't legally call them Habaneros in Mexico but they can sell any C. chinenses to Texas and call them Mexican habaneros
 
Karl,

Fiesta is a relatively large regional chain. AND, it's one of the best chains in Texas to find uncommon pepper varieties. Not uncommon by this forum's definition, but compared to every other chain in the state (unless AJ has visited them in the past in DFW).

Good luck with the ID, and I hope you save some seed and grow 'em out!

POTAWIE said:
Still likely a habanero cross if they did indeed come from Mexico. They can't legally call them Habaneros in Mexico but they can sell any C. chinenses to Texas and call them Mexican habaneros
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P, where did you read/hear that the Habs have been AOC'd in Mexico? I had not been made aware of that fact.
 
Let me look it up again

http://www.fiery-foods.com/component/content/article/57/2959
"On June 4, 2010, the states of Yucatán, Campeche and Quintana Roo were awarded a Denominación de Origen for the habanero variety of chile pepper by The Mexican Institute of Industrial Property (IMPI) of the Ministry of Economy. Thus the habanero joins the ranks of the Espelette chile of France and the smoked paprika of Spain, Pimentón de la Vera, as the only pepper products to win the same protection as Champagne, Parmesan cheese, and Dijon mustard. In Mexico, this means that if a manufacturer wants to use the word “habanero” for his product, it must contain habaneros made in these three states and nowhere else. If the pods were grown in Chiapas, the manufacturer cannout use the word “habanero” in the product's name or description. But what does this mean for U.S. manufacturers? Not much, especially considering all the “Parmesan” cheese sold in this country that is not made in the region of Parma, Italy. Yes, Champagne is protected in the U.S., where similar products must be called sparkling wine. But the spirits industry in the U.S. is highly regulated by the federal government while the cheese industry is not. So look for little change in fiery foods products in the U.S. The E.U. is another story, and I have sent this information to Harald Zoschke in Germany for his opinion.
 
Yeah. I found your other post as well as the article. It's odd to me that only those three Mexican states got the DOE and not the whole country.

Seems like Louisiana doing a DOE for the Tabasco.
 
Thats where they originated, and you can argue that they won't taste the same unless they are grown in a specific soil/environment, sort of like like champagne or Jamaican scotch bonnets
 
POTAWIE said:
Thats where they originated, and you can argue that they won't taste the same unless they are grown in a specific soil/environment, sort of like like champagne or Jamaican scotch bonnets
Click to expand...

Did they originate there? Because that's not what the name says. Thus the Tabasco comparo. :)
 
Even if they did come from Havana as some theories suggest, that was a very long time ago. The habanero we know originated in the Yucatan peninsula and surrounding areas
 
POTAWIE said:
Even if they did come from Havana as some theories suggest, that was a very long time ago. The habanero we know originated in the Yucatan peninsula and surrounding areas
Click to expand...

How long ago?

About as long ago as they started growing tobascos on Avery Island? :)
 
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