Over watering... update w/ pics

Ragnar

Ragnar

So I went away to Costa Rica for a few weeks and my plants were quite overwatered and some were just not watered at all (and died). Some are OK.
 
The last time they were drenched was on Feb 22. So 11 days. Some are starting to show green in their new leaves which I'm thankful for. I'm not sure how long to wait because the leaves still feel quite firm so I was going to wait until there is at least a little droopage. Thoughts? They've more or less stalled out and aren't really growing : (
 
Here is a photo of six showing an example of different levels of plant-happiness... top left is what I assume they all should look like, it's a fatalii that was spared the water wrath by being in a smaller cup with a sister back in a corner.
 
Opinions and advice are greatly appreciated. I restarted the ones that I lost and a bunch of the more sickly over-watered group..
 
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Thankfully the trip was well worth my current headache!
 
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They were in the basement when I was away at around 60-75f and fan 4hrs a day, I moved them into a warm room @ 73-88f and have the fan on them about 8hrs a day. Weight of cups has dropped significantly, I'd say by at least half. When I first got back and felt the weight I stuck my finger in and they were quite wet at about a 1/2in down and there was standing water in most of the outer cups (obviously I dumped that immediately and checked for more intermittently).
 
Seems most are starting to show at least a tiny bit of green. Unfortunately very few of ~75 plants look like the fatalii above, most look like the other examples, some even worse.
 
JoynersHotPeppers said:
They should be perfectly fine. Mine were in far worse shape and bounced back. I love Costa Rica!
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Good to know! Yeah CR was incredible, our first time on it's west coast in a tiny town called Drake Bay next to the spectacular Corcovado National Park. Highly recommend it to those who enjoy the more rustic, off the beaten path vacation.
 
thirdcoasttx said:
I leave my fans running 24/7.
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I'll try that, thanks for the tip man.
 
 
 
--Crap I meant to post this in Growing Hot Peppers not Hot Pepper Talk, perhaps it can be moved. My bad.
 
Brain Strain Pepper Head said:
Fans and heat or worst case H202 added but that's adding more water
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What does the H2O2 do for an over watering issue BSPH? I think that would kill off all the fuzzy myco fungi happily growing on my roots would it not?
 
Yes it will kill your myco fungi hence last resort:
 
Over Watering
Roots require Oxygen to breathe and low levels are the main cause of almost all root diseases. Both soil and hydroponic plants often fall prey to the same syndrome although it is rarely recognized as what it really is. Hydroponic crops often fail due to "root rot" and soil crops succumb to "over watering." The real cause of both these problems is a shortage of Oxygen at the root zone. In a soil system the soil consists of particles, a film of water on the particles and air spaces between the particles. When too much water is put into the soil the air spaces fill with liquid. The roots will quickly use up what Oxygen is dissolved in the water, if they haven't drunk enough of the liquid to allow air back in to the soil spaces they will stop working. In this situation roots will start dying within twenty-four hours. As the roots die the plants ability to drink water and nutrients will decrease, this will cause symptoms of nutrient deficiencies (mostly pale, slow, weak growth), and strangely they will start to wilt like they don't have enough water. It is easy to make a fatal mistake at this point and add more water.
In a Hydroponic system the cause is a more direct simple lack of oxygen in the solution, this may be from inadequate circulation and/or aeration. High reservoir temperatures also interfere with Oxygen's ability to dissolve in the water. Temperatures above 70F (20C) will eventually cause problems, 62F-65F (16C-18C) is recommended. The same symptoms will appear as with soil plants but you can also check the roots. Healthy roots should be mostly white with maybe a slight yellowish tan tinge. If they are a brownish colour with dead tips or they easily pull away there is at least the beginnings of a serious problem. An organic dirtlike rotting smell means there is already a very good chance it is too late. As roots die and rot they eat Oxygen out of the water, as Oxygen levels are even further depleted more roots die, a viscius circle may be well under way. Reduced Oxygen levels and high temperatures both encourage anaerobic bacteria and fungi. The plants may still be saved but you will have to work fast.
 
How Hydrogen Peroxide prevents root rot/overwatering.
When plants are watered with H2O2 it will break down and release Oxygen into the area around the roots. This helps stop the Oxygen from being depleted in the water filled air spaces until air can get back into them. High Oxygen levels at the roots will encourage rapid healthy root growth. In a Hydroponic system H2O2 will disperse through out the system and raise Oxygen levels as it breaks down. Strong white healthy roots with lots of fuzzy new growth will be visible. This fuzzy growth has massive surface area allowing for rapid absorption of the huge amounts of water and nutrients needed for rapid top growth. A healthy plant starts with a healthy root system.
 
What to do if you already have root rot.
In Dirt:
Use peroxided water with anti-fungicide (benomyl) and a high Phosphate fertilizer (9-45-15, 10-52-10, 0-60-0) for root growth. Root booster (5-15-5) or any other product with rooting hormone dissolved in it is helpful in regrowing roots and is strongly recommended. If a plant is wilty adding Nutri-Boost may save it. Water heavily until liquid pours out the bottom of the pot. This sound like bad idea, but it flushes out stagnant dead water and replaces it with fresh highly oxygenated water. Don't let plants sit in trays full of water, the soil will absorb this water and stay too wet. Don't water again until the pot feels light and the top inch or two of the soil are dry.
 
 
What does the H2O2 do for an over watering issue BSPH? I think that would kill off all the fuzzy myco fungi happily growing on my roots would it not?

H202 will kill the "damping off" fungus which will most likely kill your seedlings. Disturb the surface of the soil if you see some grayish stringy stuff just under the surface mix a light amount of h202 and water and mist the surface. If you dont see anything in the soil dont worry about it. Just keep a fan on them and let them dry out.
And what bsph said.
 
I see no fungi near the surface and the top inch has been dry for about 7 days now. I had also been bottom watering leading up to the incident. Thanks for the info on the H2O2 guys. I think the mix I'm using is fairly well aerated, especially now that its not sopping wet and their roots that are flood the second cups are in most cases still white and fluffy with living fungi.
 
I guess waiting it out a few more days won't hurt and if they are still a bit damp that will allow make sure I don't screw them up even more. I'll wait for a slight droop in the foliage.
 
Thanks for all your opinions, I appreciate the advice.
 
If you do decide to use peroxide, just be very careful with the strength. Peroxide is a strong oxidant and acts chemically in a similar way to bleach, albeit with friendlier breakdown products (water and oxygen). It's good for killing mircrobes in soil, but too much will also destroy your roots. I havent used this method myself on plants but would not want to use more than 0.5% peroxide solution. Commercial peroxide normally comes in 30-35% W/V which will bleach your skin white in a fraction of a second, so be careful. Dilute accordingly - this is coming from someone (i.e. me) who researched biodecontamination using peroxide vapour and have burned myself many times with it.
 
A source for peroxide use is here: I havent attempted it so cant say from experience.
 
http://www.quickgrow.com/gardening_articles/hydrogen_peroxide_horticulture.html

Another simple idea (if you can get a little aquarium air pump) is just to pump air into the roots via a tube. This will help to aerate the roots with oxygen and help to dry the waterlogged soil. Though it's probably more effective with fewer bigger pots than lots of small ones.
 
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Thanks JonnyB but as I've mentioned, I do not want to use peroxide because I have loads of mycorrizael fungi growing on my roots that the peroxide would kill (not a good thing), plus I believe I'm over the hump and things are mostly dried up. I was just curious as to how long I should wait to water if the leaves are still quite firm even though the soil is dry. I was unsure if I should give them a break so to speak as long as the foliage feels firm. As mentioned, with the mix being mostly back to normal, I do not believe aeration to be an issue whatsoever. An interesting idea about the pumps though.
 
 
MisterBigglesworth said:
Aaron, what happened with your watering system?
 
I'm always overwatering and I do it by hand. :cry:
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My "system" did not listen to my verbal or written instructions... rather they did as they saw fit and when leaves started to yellow they watered more thinking they didn't have enough.
 
 
 
 
I'll be popping out a yellow Bhut this afternoon that is being culled because the other two of the three are thriving so I plan to have a look at how dry it's soil is and go from there.
 
AaronRiot said:
Thanks JonnyB but as I've mentioned, I do not want to use peroxide because I have loads of mycorrizael fungi growing on my roots that the peroxide would kill (not a good thing), plus I believe I'm over the hump and things are mostly dried up. I was just curious as to how long I should wait to water if the leaves are still quite firm even though the soil is dry. I was unsure if I should give them a break so to speak as long as the foliage feels firm. As mentioned, with the mix being mostly back to normal, I do not believe aeration to be an issue whatsoever. An interesting idea about the pumps though.
 
 
 
My "system" did not listen to my verbal or written instructions... rather they did as they saw fit and when leaves started to yellow they watered more thinking they didn't have enough.
 
 
 
 
I'll be popping out a yellow Bhut this afternoon that is being culled because the other two of the three are thriving so I plan to have a look at how dry it's soil is and go from there.
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Daggone, you used the same system I did!    ;) 
 
Well, I popped that aforementioned yellow bhut out and this is what I found:
(*by damp I mean like a well rung sponge, I doubt I could squeeze a drop out of it but can certainly feel the moisture when rubbed between the fingers)
I think I will wait until at least after the weekend to water them give this new info. Opinions?
 
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Here is a shot of it's root system after shaking off all the dirt and myco, not bad eh?
 
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And while I'm at it here is my set up, suggestions welcome:
 
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Light is 4' x 4bulb HO T-5 6500ks - they're about 14" from the canopy, I was finding (at least at the lower basement temps) that there was a lot of purpling foliage so I raised them intermittently to this height..
Avg temp 82.5f
As you may notice the red solos look a bit popped up, I found that I can set them up like that just by offsetting them a little, and I think it's allowing for some nice air circulation between the two cups now. I might stick some water bottle caps in the white cups to get the same result...just thought of this now.
 
Back right corner there are baby cacti under the cheesecloth and the ziplocks are the second wave of peppers.. mostly backups that I was thinking I'd race with the stunted yellows - survival of the fittest.
 
And lastly a wider look at my sea of yellow:
 
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Again thanks for looking and chiming in with comments as this is my first indoor start.
 
They look like they are going to bounce back just fine.
 
I just thought of an idea for any future vacations and relying on anyone to water. Have them take a picture and send it to you each day and you let them know if they need watering. A few years ago that would be ridiculous, but with stupid technology its not really a hassle unless you don't have a phone/internet/digital camera.
 
Dunlop 33 nylon - the pick to take to the island!
 
Glad the plants are gonna make it AR.  
 
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