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Plants dying after epsom spraying....

R

rhm3769

I doubt everything is directly related to them being sprayed with epsom salt. My White habs and Butch T's are the only things looking better after spraying. The chocolate habs were sad looking before. Santa Fe Grande is still going strong, but the seedling leaves are turning yellow and look droopy. FireCracker is droopy. Scotch Bonnet, leaves are starting to curl under, turning yellow. They were almost yellow to begin with, some tiny brown spots on the tip of one of the leaves.

Everything has been getting water and everything at the same time, just different amounts as they're in different sized pots. The soil and starting mix are the same. The epsom salt was mixed less than a tbsp to 750 ml water. Sure some of this is from overwatering, it has been cooler than normal since I last watered them, maybe 15 minutes of sun a day, rainy and humid when not raining. The rain doesn't reach them on the balcony. There is very little wind reaching them on the balcony, but it is present.

Even with the rain, the two plants down at work that have been fighting through ant problems are in better shape than most of mine at home after spraying, and they get sprayed during the day. I sprayed everything at home way after the sun went down.

Any ideas? Overwatering? Not enough wind? Epsom salt isn't good for all plants? Lack of sun getting to them? Any way to come back from it all? Not planning on there being any sun over the weekend either, we have another typhoon coming. While it'll keep the bugs away, I need the sun more than anything.... And sitting inside for 3 days where it's 78 as opposed to 85+ and no sun probably isn't good for them, either....
 
That's not really enough for us to go on to fully help you out - would you please post some pics of the plants?

But regarding the watering.... I have several different varieties of chile plants, and find that some varieties uptake water at different rates than others. I have to water my aji habaneros and douglahs, for example, more frequently than the other plants. In fact, if I watered the other plants as frequently as I have to water the aji habanero and douglah, the other plants would complain about it by turning yellow and such.

Also, yellowing is frequently caused by overwatering - even if they aren't getting rained on, you might be watering them too frequently. Chile plants prefer to be somewhat moist, but not wet. Are you waiting until the leaves droop a little between waterings? Again, pictures will help us to see and better diagnose what's going on.
 
The last time I watered them was Monday.... Normally water two/three times a week, but with the lack of sun and the increased humidity, ive only had to water once so far.... I'll have to take some pictures tomorrow, when light is better....
 
It should be 1Tbsp to 1 Gallon of water for soil feeding or foliar spraying sounds like you have over done it. I would flood with water. You can change the soil but its already in the plant - pepper plants dont typically need a whole lot of attention they dont get it in the wild and do great. Sometimes with our nano gardening we over do it. Hopefully it comes back for you.
 
rhm3769 said:
Normally water two/three times a week
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Depending upon the variety and temperatures, that is too much in general. Most of my plants only get watered once a week, while the thirsty girls get watered twice. When the temps are mid- to upper-90's most get it twice a week and the thirsty girls three. We don't get into the 100's here usually, but I imagine that if it did, the watering would increase due to a higher rate of evaporation. I will also qualify that by letting you know I've got my plants strategically placed so they are not in full sun all afternoon. They get full morning sun and then a bit in the early afternoon, but then they're in shade.

Still, mid-80's is not bad. Back off your watering a bit, and you should start to see darker green leaves forming in the next week or two. Note that yellowed leaves will not return to green.
 
geeme said:
pepper plants dont typically need a whole lot of attention they dont get it in the wild. Sometimes with our nano gardening we over do it.
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Yep, along with many others, i have found that although others may add nutrients and other bits n bobs along the way, my plants benefit the most from me "leaving them the hell alone"!


I must admit that i did try adding nutes at the beginning of my grow.....but after it nearly killed all my plants, i then decided to add nothing at all...and the plants are now doing fine!
 
nee said:
I must admit that i did try adding nutes at the beginning of my grow.....but after it nearly killed all my plants, i then decided to add nothing at all...and the plants are now doing fine!
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I couldn't tell you the balance point, but if you're growing in pots you're going to have to add something at some time.

If you're growing in the ground you can probably leave them alone completely.
 
I add fertilizer to both ground plants and potted, though both are in soil that has been reused for years. Generally I find that a small plant needs very little fertilizer, when most water is lost to evaporation the soil fertilizer level can easily rise too high. I mix fertilizer in with the soil initially along with compost then wait about three weeks after repotting to give them any more.
 
I'm thinking it was just too much spraying and too strong for the leaves, the plants are still standing and the newer leaves that were starting to grow seem unaffected.... Funny it didn't affect the Butch T's that are much smaller than all but the Chocolate habs.... I'll see how the sun they will get today affect things.

When watering, I tend to pour the water around the edges of the pot to avoid disturbing the soil around the roots and stem. I add in little amounts until water comes out the bottom. When the tray underneath is dry and the surface is dry, I repeat. Some are still in small pots, it's not accurate because it's in the sun and sitting on the cement, but the thermometer reads 110+ on most days when it's really just below 90.... So the water is gone pretty fast on full sun days....
 
rhm3769 said:
I'm thinking it was just too much spraying and too strong for the leaves, the plants are still standing and the newer leaves that were starting to grow seem unaffected.... Funny it didn't affect the Butch T's that are much smaller than all but the Chocolate habs.... I'll see how the sun they will get today affect things.

When watering, I tend to pour the water around the edges of the pot to avoid disturbing the soil around the roots and stem. I add in little amounts until water comes out the bottom. When the tray underneath is dry and the surface is dry, I repeat. Some are still in small pots, it's not accurate because it's in the sun and sitting on the cement, but the thermometer reads 110+ on most days when it's really just below 90.... So the water is gone pretty fast on full sun days....
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How big are your plants and what size pots are they in? Are they getting 15 minutes of sun a day because that's all you're getting where you live or is that all you're giving them? I'm no pro like some growers on here, but it sounds like they need a lot more sun unless you just started hardening them off or something. Personally I've noticed my plants need at least 5 hours of direct sunlight a day or their growth slows big time. When temperatures here hit 100+ about a month ago, I started giving them only 2 hours of direct sun a day fearing the heat would cause all the blooms to drop, but the lack of sun slowed everything down. Existing pods were developing slower and I was getting fewer new pods and blooms so I just got some shade cloth and only use it when it's 98+ and went back to at least 5 hours a day and they took off again and they're covered in pods now.

Not sure how the leaves on your chocolate hab look, but the leaves on mine have been bumpy/wrinkly since it was about 6 inches tall, and I added epsom salt to the soil when potting up and sprayed it multiple times with cal-mag, but nothing. Other than the bumpy leaves, it's healthy has hell with dark green leaves, and lots of pods, so I stopped trying to fix it after seeing several people on here post that their habs look the same way. Everything I was doing to fix it probably did more harm than good. It hasn't happened to my pumpkin hab or scotch bonnet and they're all in the same soil, get the same amount of direct sunlight a day, and get watered and fertilized the same, so I'm convinced mine just looks like that.
 
It's been cloudy and rainy all week with random breaks in the clouds for a few minutes here and there.... They normally get about 6 hours of afternoon sun....

The smallest plants just have the first set of true leaves and the smallest pot is 7"....

The chocolate Habs are considerably smaller when they sprouted and appear stunted.... The leaves look more like they've been dried out than anything....

Sadly, just as the sun starts showing, the wind is picking up already.... Don't know how much longer I can leave them out there before it starts messing hte leaves up....
 
rhm3769 said:
It's been cloudy and rainy all week with random breaks in the clouds for a few minutes here and there.... They normally get about 6 hours of afternoon sun....

The smallest plants just have the first set of true leaves and the smallest pot is 7"....

The chocolate Habs are considerably smaller when they sprouted and appear stunted.... The leaves look more like they've been dried out than anything....
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Your plants sound younger than I thought when I posted my previous message. I don't want to give you bad advice, so do you have any current pictures? My plants I was talking about earlier are all 24-30 inches tall or more and have several dozen pods each, so they can handle the high temps and sun.
 
Not of all of them.... My biggest ones are about 7 weeks old and were doing fine until the wind wrecked them.... I'll be posting new pictures as this is a big set back.... The smaller ones weren't bothered by the wind....

Fire cracker and chocolate Habs are the only two that didn't make a full recovery from the Epsom salt.... All all about two weeks old with the exception of the white Habs....
 
Take it easy, stop, let nature do its work! You'll be Ok, just let them dry out and then water for the time being. Don't pfafff around with them , they'll recover, just relax.

Hopefully, with the mild weather till January here in the orient, you'll be OK. It's very hot here right now. You plants will get going in Sept-October I bet.
 
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They were almost yellow to begin with, some tiny brown spots on the tip of one of the leaves.
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I add in little amounts until water comes out the bottom. When the tray underneath is dry and the surface is dry, I repeat.
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Way over watered to begin with. They don't need much water.
I know it's tricky with young seedlings as under watered means sudden death. While with older plants you can let them wilt, seedlings will just die when your back is turned when they dry out.
But you really have to control their environment, or their watering better. Never soak the pots up every few days, especially if it's large pots like it sound like (try to keep seedlings in 2-4" pots at most).
But if you can't control the environment, you'd probably be better of controlling the water more. You know those small 500ml hand trigger bottles? Maybe for you next plants give them just 2 pumps per day only from one of them. If they do OK, then the next week eve less water, like less pumps, or only every second day. I don't know you weather, but I only water my plants every 4-5 days, but it's not hot or windy here - with a spray bottle I mean, if I was to fully drench the soil like you do, I wouldn't have to water more than every 2 weeks.

For the current plants, put them out of the winds and out of direct sun (but still some natural light - eg near a window sill) and just leave them, do nothing for 2 weeks.

Epsom salts is good for magnesium and sulfur, best foliar sprayed though only as salts aren't good in any soil of course. But it seems like you've been clutching at straws trying to find what you think they need. But as said by others, sometimes they just need you to leave them alone.
Seedlings don't need much water, and don't really need much ferts or minerals, just keep them not too wet, not to dry, not too hot, not too cold.
Seems simple but yes I know sometimes it's not so easy as we can't control the sun, wind or nature in general.
Better to plant more seeds, and take a more hands off approach rather than over fuss and damage them with too much attention though. Be more hands off and strongest survive style thinking IMHO. Not the best solution, but better to do that while you learn, rather than killing them all with over attention. Added benefit of that method is at least the plants that are the strongest survive, so you get to save pods and seeds from the best plants anyway...
 
Pablo_h said:
Way over watered to begin with. They don't need much water.
I know it's tricky with young seedlings as under watered means sudden death. While with older plants you can let them wilt, seedlings will just die when your back is turned when they dry out.
But you really have to control their environment, or their watering better. Never soak the pots up every few days, especially if it's large pots like it sound like (try to keep seedlings in 2-4" pots at most).
But if you can't control the environment, you'd probably be better of controlling the water more. You know those small 500ml hand trigger bottles? Maybe for you next plants give them just 2 pumps per day only from one of them. If they do OK, then the next week eve less water, like less pumps, or only every second day. I don't know you weather, but I only water my plants every 4-5 days, but it's not hot or windy here - with a spray bottle I mean, if I was to fully drench the soil like you do, I wouldn't have to water more than every 2 weeks.

For the current plants, put them out of the winds and out of direct sun (but still some natural light - eg near a window sill) and just leave them, do nothing for 2 weeks.

Epsom salts is good for magnesium and sulfur, best foliar sprayed though only as salts aren't good in any soil of course. But it seems like you've been clutching at straws trying to find what you think they need. But as said by others, sometimes they just need you to leave them alone.
Seedlings don't need much water, and don't really need much ferts or minerals, just keep them not too wet, not to dry, not too hot, not too cold.
Seems simple but yes I know sometimes it's not so easy as we can't control the sun, wind or nature in general.
Better to plant more seeds, and take a more hands off approach rather than over fuss and damage them with too much attention though. Be more hands off and strongest survive style thinking IMHO. Not the best solution, but better to do that while you learn, rather than killing them all with over attention. Added benefit of that method is at least the plants that are the strongest survive, so you get to save pods and seeds from the best plants anyway...
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Thanks, as it has been cloudy and cooler, I haven't had to water them since Monday, it's sunday here now, so about a week.... The epsom salt was only sprayed on the leaves, and normally I only spray each plant with a pump or two, probably went overboard this last time around.... When I'm watering, I don't think the amount I'm giving is too much, just enough to start running out the bottom, I learned my lesson the first time around, most of the water would almost immediately run out the bottom so I was overwatering and killed everything before they grew the 2nd set of leaves. Everything seems to be working, I have four plants that have survived 7 weeks with no issues other than the two at work and the bug problems there. I start my seeds in half an empty water bottle, spray the top as it dries out.... Full sun all day requires spraying everyday here for water bottles. It isn't much of an improvement moving to the 7" pots unless I leave alot of water in the bottom. Once I get to 10-11" pots, I can go a few days before I get dry spots at the surface....

The wind is only from this tropical storm we have coming through. I thought they would have been sturdy enough to withstand them and they could use the sunlight as it has been cloudy almost all week. Surprisingly, the seedlings handled it much better than those with pencil-thick stems.... And it was more from the gusts than sustained winds, they're inside for now....

I wish a window was an option, but it isn't.... No windows here that they would benefit in, one is too small and the other doesn't get enough sun as well as being in my son's room, it isn't high enough for him to not mess wit them. Everything else are sliding glass doors and impossible to block off from a 20-month old.... And if it was, that would make it unbearable in here, housing already has ac set to go no lower than 78. I'm fine with the heat, but 78 is pretty warm inside....
 
When you water, do not water until water comes out of the bottom of the pots. Only water them with a few mL, ie plain water, a pump or two with your spray bottle is what I meant.
Watering until water comes out of the bottom means either the media is saturated, (or hydrophobic with the water running down the sides - but the palnt would be wilted then, not yellow, so lets assume saturated) The aim is to keep the plants slightly moist, never get the roots very wet. AIr needs to get to the roots too, it's as important as the water. Easy to fix underwatering by wetting the leaves, hard to fix soggy roots that makes the plant yellow without repotting into drier soil.
 
750 ml bottle, between 4 7" pots, 1 10" and 1 11" and four water bottles lasts at least 2 waterings, more goes towards the bigger pots. I don't see how a pump or two from a spray bottle is enough water.

I'm having different issues with different plants, still have to get around to pictures.... Scotch Bonnet is yellow with brown spots on the leaves, seedling leaves droopy. I found a stinkbug on it earlier today, it looks almost similar to another plant that I let a stinkbug stay around, it wasn't one I planned on keeping around, figured let it be attacked so I could see how it was affected to better tell when one was attacked.... I've killed 5 of them at least, today.

Chocolate habanero and fire cracker look like the leaves have been dried out, but it is just the leaves, the stem has no issues and from what I can tell, new leaves are still growing, both had one of the set of first true leaves grown without the matching leave yet. Everything else has recovered from the epsom salt episode.

As far as the Scotch Bonnets, I have two, both are a yellow/light green color, when the second set of true leaves start growing, the first set starts with the brown spots near the tips, both plants.... And from the ones I planted the same day as these, they sprouted and grew the quickest to true leaves....
 
rhm3769 said:
750 ml bottle, between 4 7" pots, 1 10" and 1 11" and four water bottles lasts at least 2 waterings, more goes towards the bigger pots. I don't see how a pump or two from a spray bottle is enough water.
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You don't think a few mL every 2 days is enough water? It is. It just depends on heat, grow media ( edit:different types have different moisture retention rates), light, wind etc.

Read this and learn from a master:
http://thehotpepper...._20#entry602989

I start mine of in coir, and it's cold and winter here, so I use next to no water. If you are using SRM or something well draining, and it's hot an windy, you might need more water. But the point is you still don't need a lot of water.

Also like I said before, it's a LOT easier to judge these things using smaller pots. When the seedling is dry, the pot is dry. With large pots, when the seedling may need water, the pot is still sopping wet, it's just that it's roots aren't down low enough into the pot where the moisture is yet, so regular watering means a sodden low oxygen soil mixture which is bad.
 
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