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nutrients Nutrient ratios and mixing and matching nutrients.

S

SmurfKing

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I have been waiting to see someone come out with a topic like this with no luck. I mainly wanted to get into what the best ratio is at certain times of the growing cycles, then the PPM or EC. So in this topic I want to let all noobies
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and experienced grows know what we all want to know. These are the cycles we should kind of go off of and kind of get a list together to help everyone.

-Germination-
-Seedling-
-Vegetative-
-Veg Clones-
-Change Over-
-Flowering-
-Flo Clones-

(N-P-K) I have heard a great ratio for growing vegetative would be 2-1-3. So basically that could be 8-4-12 or 4-2-6, but still with knowing a ratio like that PPM still comes into play. Then for flowering you may want a 1-2-3 ratio. So that would be 4-8-12 or 2-4-6. But at the end of this I just wanted to have a little guide to give people a example to go off of like this.

(example)
-Germination- 1-1-1 (50-100ppm)
-Seedling- 2-2-2 (300-450ppm)
-Vegetative- 2-1-4 (350-550ppm)
-Veg Clones- 2-2-3 (350-400ppm)
-Change Over- 2-3-4 (500-700ppm)
-Flowering- 1-2-4 (700-1000ppm)
-Flo Clones- 1-2-3 (300-450ppm)
(example)

This is a good example I feel but by the end of this I want to have a chart we all agree on, then we can move on to one for soil also. If people actually have recipes or some nutrient no one is using, but might need to. Let us know please this post is looking for ya'll.


I have, I don't know how many different nutrient solutions and used to mix and match them to get great results, but never kept good notes on those batches. Well had them on a marker board, but it always got wiped off before I could record it accurately. I will list some of the types I have and the ratios pretty soon. Thanks everyone hope this comes in handy!
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That's just way too much crap for me to deal with, figuring out the peat/compost/base/perlite/vermiculite ratios during the making of my own potting soil was a big enough pain in the ass.
 
Wow. Sounds like a doctoral thesis to me and I'm not kidding. You're talking about a huge amount of information here. Trying to get every grower to agree on types, amounts, timing of fertilizers and growing mediums would be like trying to get Democrats and Republicans to love each other--it just isn't going to happen.
 
I just follow the label on the bottle. Seems to work well for me since I switched to better neuts. I'm way to new at the nutrients thing to have anything constructive to add to this thread, but looking forward to learning a thing or two.
 
Yeah I know what you mean but that is why it is best for everyone to join in. Then it will give people a general guide to go on. Like you said you follow the label after you got your new nutes, but see if you let us know what mutes and just like when they are small you use what the label says or just something like that . Then it is still probably helpful to others, if we can't get a whole little guide going on that we can all come close to, or everyone make their own. Then we can share it and just let people know this worked well with those types of nutes/plants. Who knows just if we can give people something that would be helpful.

See I had started using this advanced nutrients with the PH perfect thing added to it so it keeps the ph always at a good range, but I used that and mix it with others things. Which make a kind of ph balanced formula, then it got me wondering if others do the same?
 
millworkman said:
I use a teaspoon per gallon and never measure ppm or ec or ph. :) Maxibloom by general hydroponics.
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Thanks man good to know, so do you grow just hydroponics or soil also?

Yeah I had checked and the N-P-K ratio of that Maxibloom and it is 5-15-14 . But do you also use the Maxigrow which is 10-5-14 ..?
 
Nice man great to know!! Thanks. I will post the different nutes I have and then maybe we can turn this into a testing log. I will test different ones normal strength then mix and match and see what happens. Others can do the same as well! But I like your input so far! :dance:

But see I was checking the ratio of yours and the bloom is basically a 1-3-3 just about the K is 14 so it is one off so you can say 1-3-2.8 which is a good one! Then the grow would be about 2-1-3 or to be exact 2-1-2.8

Well for so how do your do it for your seedling vege and bloom ..? Is it always 1tsp for all or do you go half when young and double when they get older?
 
This pH perfect thing you mention. You're saying you just add some of it and your growing medium is perfectly balanced pH wise? Adding it to other ferts makes the entire mix pH balanced?
 
In my drip hydro pepper I use Soul Synthetics.
I mix both grow and bloom together for 2 tsp ea per gallon. I never check ec or ppm.
I only make sure the ph is in the proper zone.

My peppers in PromixBx soil-less growing medium get General Hydropoics General Organics.
With these guys I too mix the grow and bloom along with a few others from the line.
I just make sure my n-p-k #'s are even (ex. 10-10-10 )
No ph adjustments for them due to my mix having dolomitic limestone mixed in to act as a ph buffer.

I try and keep it simple. With decent results.
 
CR I wasn't aware that dolomitic limestone is a pH buffer. I always thought it was used to lower the acidity of soil. If you're soil is alkaline and what ever you're adding is also on the alkaline side then the limestone isn't going to prevent the pH from going higher. When you say "buffer" that leads me to believe it's going to keep the pH at a certain level regardless of what you ad. It doesn't work that way.
 
patrick said:
CR I wasn't aware that dolomitic limestone is a pH buffer. I always thought it was used to lower the acidity of soil. If you're soil is alkaline and what ever you're adding is also on the alkaline side then the limestone isn't going to prevent the pH from going higher. When you say "buffer" that leads me to believe it's going to keep the pH at a certain level regardless of what you ad. It doesn't work that way.
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I stand corrected.
 
patrick said:
This pH perfect thing you mention. You're saying you just add some of it and your growing medium is perfectly balanced pH wise? Adding it to other ferts makes the entire mix pH balanced?
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Well I will take a picture of it later have to make space on my phone . Then I will post it but it is a certain series of their grow mutes that is supposed to keep the ph calibrated in a good range but it is a 3 part nute. So sometimes I leave out one maybe bloom and might add my technaflora bloom instead because it had better amounts of what I felt it needs. Although the nutrients say you should not mix and match I still do and get a better ph then what I would had using just technaflora . You know what I mean ! But my normal waters PH is like 8.2 or something and that will bring it to 6.3 or so . Then I may lower it a little bit more .

ColoradoRonin said:
In my drip hydro pepper I use Soul Synthetics.
I mix both grow and bloom together for 2 tsp ea per gallon. I never check ec or ppm.
I only make sure the ph is in the proper zone.

My peppers in PromixBx soil-less growing medium get General Hydropoics General Organics.
With these guys I too mix the grow and bloom along with a few others from the line.
I just make sure my n-p-k #'s are even (ex. 10-10-10 )
No ph adjustments for them due to my mix having dolomitic limestone mixed in to act as a ph buffer.

I try and keep it simple. With decent results.
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Thanks man that sounds great! So basically use a even ratio with great results. :party: Nice! I will check up on those ones that you spoke about in a sec.! Then after I answer everyone I will make a list of all the ones I have!
 
ColoradoRonin said:
I stand corrected.
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Hope I didn't come off as some know it all, apologies if I did.

Smurfking you sound like I did many moons ago when I first started growing peppers. I would read everything I could get my hands on and had a plethora of different types of fertilizers and amendments and additives. My local hydro store loved me! After trying everything I finally came to the conclusion that a good growing medium, basic ferts and knowing when to water does a fine job and cuts back on the expenses and stress of growing peppers. Gardening is supposed to be fun and relaxing and save you money and provide you with much tastier and healthier food. I applaud your attempt to try and create the perfect mix but it's impossible. People will always use what they think is the best and what they have the best success with. Not all things are available to all people too. You're going to get so many different responses from folks that it's going to take a few pages just to list it all of the different things they use, the amounts and the timing. Save yourself the headache. Read other folks glogs, start your own and document your success and failures.
 
patrick said:
CR I wasn't aware that dolomitic limestone is a pH buffer. I always thought it was used to lower the acidity of soil. If you're soil is alkaline and what ever you're adding is also on the alkaline side then the limestone isn't going to prevent the pH from going higher. When you say "buffer" that leads me to believe it's going to keep the pH at a certain level regardless of what you ad. It doesn't work that way.
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I see what you mean on that but I get what he means too. It is a buffer but I believe it is a slower release then just using adjusted ph water. But then the problem with adjusted ph water is buffers adjust it back out. The [background=rgb(255, 244, 228)]PromixBx soil-less growing medium has ph adjusting stuff in it that keeps it balanced. Then if you use General Organics it will be all organic and keep stuff balanced out! [/background]
Also dolomitic limestone are added to soils and soilless potting mixes to lower their acidity and as a magnesium source. But usually I think soilless mixes are more neutral then alkaline but it depends on what is mixed in it. Tap water is usually very alkaline and I think that is more what the dolomitic limestone and buffers aim to take care of mainly, so you don't have to do any ph adjusting of your water at all.
 
millworkman said:
Always 1tsp per gallon. Peppers don't need a veg vs bloom.
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That is great to know! They do seem to flower just automatically. Once you see them doing the Y split then you know flowers are soon to come.

I will try the only bloom formula on some of mine and see how it works! Thanks.

patrick said:
Smurfking you sound like I did many moons ago when I first started growing peppers. I would read everything I could get my hands on and had a plethora of different types of fertilizers and amendments and additives. My local hydro store loved me! After trying everything I finally came to the conclusion that a good growing medium, basic ferts and knowing when to water does a fine job and cuts back on the expenses and stress of growing peppers. Gardening is supposed to be fun and relaxing and save you money and provide you with much tastier and healthier food. I applaud your attempt to try and create the perfect mix but it's impossible. People will always use what they think is the best and what they have the best success with. Not all things are available to all people too. You're going to get so many different responses from folks that it's going to take a few pages just to list it all of the different things they use, the amounts and the timing. Save yourself the headache. Read other folks glogs, start your own and document your success and failures.
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No actually for me I have been growing plants since I was 6 and playing with hydroponics since I was about 12. I know all about the nutes and all that type of thing and keep a variety on hand. I used to breed orchids but got bored with it because they grow too slow, then always had a love for heat, so moved on to peppers and just like orchids they have a wide variety to choose and breed. I also build hydroponic and Aeroponic systems. But the whole reason why I was wondering about all this is because I do micropropagation. And eventually was gonna start playing around with trying it on peppers and in doing so you have to decide a median for making the jelly type substance they grow in. Some people use homemade mixes made from hydroponic nutes and that was something I was gonna try but I have the original mixes also. So with peoples info it will help decide me decide what to start playing around with. Then I was gonna make a topic on good formulas for micropropagation and peppers because I have really seen little on this anywhere. And I just like to know what others are doing. I think for people to go to all types of different grow logs when they can get the info on one page, it is just a little bit easier to have one page. Then they get what they are looking for. I am not the only one that would probably like to know this, I am sure.

Then too from all the info here people who make their own nutrients can look at what people use and see what works and put together own nutrient together piece by piece. Which would be the best thing for me to do for micropropagation but is costly. I hope this helps and explains a little bit more to what this is all about.
 
I am sorry for being so negative about what you're trying to do.

I keep thinking about my local hydro store. They must have a couple of hundred, at least, different types of things you can use to fertilize plants that I can't see how anyone could figure out which one is the best for every situation. Take dolomite limestone for example. Without testing your soil how much do you use? To be effective it has to be mixed in specific ratios with magnesium and even those ratios depend upon the type of growing medium you're using. How specific are you going to get? How many different minerals do plants need? Micro and macro? Three primary are Nitrogen, Phosphorous and Potassium. secondary are calcium magnesium and sulpher. Then the micro minerals, boron, copper, iron, chloride, manganese molybdnum and zinc. How do you figure out the correct amounts of these? Each type of medium is going to provide some at least but without testing each one how do you decide the amount to add? If there were just a couple of standard growing mediums you might be able to come up with some numbers but people make their own all the time. How about growing in the ground? The variables there are going to be huge!

If I was doing something like this I think I would concentrate on figuring out what works the best in one specific growing medium. Even then you're going to get a myriad of different answers from people. What works for one grower might work for all but there will be people who swear what they do works better. You could come up with the ultimate mix of medium and ferts and show photos of huge plants covered in pods but that still isn't going to guarantee the next guy will have the same success. Most people will start tweaking things the moment they start.
 
Patrick said:

patrick said:
I am sorry for being so negative about what you're trying to do.

I keep thinking about my local hydro store. They must have a couple of hundred, at least, different types of things you can use to fertilize plants that I can't see how anyone could figure out which one is the best for every situation. Take dolomite limestone for example. Without testing your soil how much do you use? To be effective it has to be mixed in specific ratios with magnesium and even those ratios depend upon the type of growing medium you're using. How specific are you going to get? How many different minerals do plants need? Micro and macro? Three primary are Nitrogen, Phosphorous and Potassium. secondary are calcium magnesium and sulpher. Then the micro minerals, boron, copper, iron, chloride, manganese molybdnum and zinc. How do you figure out the correct amounts of these? Each type of medium is going to provide some at least but without testing each one how do you decide the amount to add? If there were just a couple of standard growing mediums you might be able to come up with some numbers but people make their own all the time. How about growing in the ground? The variables there are going to be huge!

If I was doing something like this I think I would concentrate on figuring out what works the best in one specific growing medium. Even then you're going to get a myriad of different answers from people. What works for one grower might work for all but there will be people who swear what they do works better. You could come up with the ultimate mix of medium and ferts and show photos of huge plants covered in pods but that still isn't going to guarantee the next guy will have the same success. Most people will start tweaking things the moment they start.
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I said earlier in this thread:

Jeff H said:
I just follow the label on the bottle. Seems to work well for me since I switched to better neuts. I'm way to new at the nutrients thing to have anything constructive to add to this thread, but looking forward to learning a thing or two.
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I think I'll just stick with my way for now with the two part nutes, not too much thinking involved. I'll give myself a migrane trying to fathom the myriad of possibilities that Patrick describes. :think: :think:
 
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