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fermenting Everything Yellow, Get In! - Ferment #2

boostdemon

boostdemon

Well a week ago i made a mash of everything red here: http://thehotpepper.com/topic/49741-everything-red-get-in-ferment-1/
Its not failed yet, but its also not succeeding either. I got some feedback, asked some more questions and got some more answers - thanks to a bunch of you in the chat room who were extremely helpful clarifying some things.
 
So tonight i had to bite the bullet and try and make another to use up some peppers that were wilting away. Initial plans were for a mango based sauce with chocolate habaneros for the heat. However, i just started collecting all the yellow stuff around and came up with this pile: 
 

Everything Yellow by boostdemon, on Flickr
 
Unfortunately, the chocolate habs and white bullet habs from a couple weeks ago were moldy inside. I ddidn't get to them fast enough and they turned on me. womp womp. I did however get that apple from my friends tree, and i have a massive supply of yellow devils tongue outside in the garden... change of plans.The green small peppers werent very flavorful so i took them out of the mash plans... and added a white wine instead thanks to Turbo's idea here
 
15112086696_30c5fea0c7_c.jpg

Everything Yellow by boostdemon, on Flickr
 
15112090626_f49360e486_c.jpg

Everything Yellow by boostdemon, on Flickr
 
Mash consists of: 
 
1 - Mango 
1 - Yellow/Red Delicious Apple (peeled)
1/4 cup of sauvignon blanc
7 Devils Tongue peppers (deseeded)
3 slices of Lemon
 
From what people were saying i should leave more room and brine up on top of the mash so this was a small recipe. It only filled about 1/2 this 1.5qt jar. I'm hoping the apple sinks otherwise i'll probably have to figure out a way to weight the mash down. I added the lemon slices on the outsides and filled up the rest of the jar with a 3.5% brine mixture. I left a lot more room at the top as well based on some suggestions. I also skipped any kind of yogurt whey starter. This smells great, and burns your nose promptly after you think it smells great just to remind you that its 'effin hot. I suspect if this works, it will have to be cut with something else prior to bottling.
 
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Everything Yellow by boostdemon, on Flickr
 
What do you guys think? Will it work? 
 
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Just my thoughts here Dana:
 
No salt or starter in the ingredients list - nothing to keep the nasties at bay before the lacto gets going.
 
Why the wine?  Depending on how sweet the wine is I don't know if the lacto will use the sugar in it.  Plenty of sugar in the apple and mango already.  1/4 cup isn't much though, so I doubt it will hurt the final product.
 
Adding lemon to start can inhibit fermentation imo - best to add acids after fermentation is complete.
 
Your head space is fine.  I think the red ferment looks good too (esp w the salt and a bit of whey).  Really liked the airlock tutorial in the red ferment thread - valuable knowledge there.  
 
Given what I see about this batch right now I'd likely cook down this mash and bottle it like a normal vinegar based sauce.  
 
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SmokenFire said:
Just my thoughts here Dana:
 
No salt or starter in the ingredients list - nothing to keep the nasties at bay before the lacto gets going.
 
Why the wine?  Depending on how sweet the wine is I don't know if the lacto will use the sugar in it.  Plenty of sugar in the apple and mango already.  1/4 cup isn't much though, so I doubt it will hurt the final product.
 
Adding lemon to start can inhibit fermentation imo - best to add acids after fermentation is complete.
 
Your head space is fine.  I think the red ferment looks good too (esp w the salt and a bit of whey).  Really liked the airlock tutorial in the red ferment thread - valuable knowledge there.  
 
Given what I see about this batch right now I'd likely cook down this mash and bottle it like a normal vinegar based sauce.  
Click to expand...
 
theres at least a cup of 3.5% brine... i did 1 tablespoon in 2 cups of distilled water. then filled up the jar about almost equal parts with brine. I will probably have to separate that or cook it down for processing eventually.
 
wine cause it was there and the rest of the bottle went down the drain (half opened and sat in the wife's car for a week)... and who knows maybe it'll get tart and do something cool? i dunno. 
 
Yeah i am hoping that the 3 thin whole slices of lemon will not be as bad as juice.
 
the mango/apple/devils tongue was definitely a great combo. I have 1 more mango so maybe i'll try and make another sauce and try my first cooked and canned variety! Thanks for the tips 
 
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Couple of notes for you Dana just from my experience.
 
-  I have never included any alcohol in any of my Ferments so I don't know how it will affect it from experience but, if you look at how vinegar is made it should be fine. Vinegar is made from Alcohol by a bacteria, commonly referred to as Mother, which eats the alcohol and converts it to acid. So, you should be fine.
 
-  Next time you want to add lemon to the ferment try zesting the lemons and adding the zest to it. You'll get the lemon flavors from the essential oils in the rind without any of the bitterness of the pith and if you still need additional acid to lower the Ph you can still add the juice during processing of the mash into sauce.
 
-  You have plenty of sugars in there for the LAB to feast on, didn't see how long you're planning to let it run for, and I'd thin a good 45 day run should have it all nice and happy. if you find it's a bit too sour you might want to consider using some Agave nectar, Honey or some Brown Sugar in it, I always try to use something that will add to the flavor profile and plain white sugar really doesn't do that. 
 
Loving the color, that's a very bright tropical sun kind of yellow :)
 
Cheers,
RM
 
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I've got a ferment going right now where I used a sweet white wine (a Riesling I think) instead of water.  The ferment kicked off a bit slow, it took about 7 days for the first bubbles to show up.  But the fermentation process has been going strong ever since.  Its now 30+ days later and its still producing bubbles.  Now I have NO idea what the ferment process will do to the wine; turn it to vinegar, nothing at all, become totally nasty...who knows :)
 
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RM: Awesome, thanks. yeah I wasn't sure about the zest because its so bitter so i wanted something i could actually remove before processing but hopefully infuse some flavor. I will try just the zest next time. I suspect the ferment will significantly lessen the sugars so yes, i will load it back up when its processed. I want this to be like a hot sweet-tart.
 
Turbo: Yeah i'll let this go for a bit... i was waiting to see how yours turned out but meh, we'll take a similar route and maybe end up with different experiences :) 
 
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Ok, need some advise on this mold. I saw enough bubbles going that i was confident i could crack this one open, clean off the top layer of crud and mold spots and then cap it, shake out the bubbles... and get positive pressure in there. So thats what i did. It smelled ok, but not sure if this is a goner or not?
 
Before opening: 
15211342740_48912c404a_c.jpg

 
The mold issue: Definitely blue mold spot and a few black ones on the sides.. had a decent "crust" on top that i scooped off: 
15374975566_5083a350c7_c.jpg
 
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Dana it doesn't look like a goner to me.  If you scraped all the mold and yeast out it's probably ok.  Three plus weeks in you're probably ok to pull and process.  
 
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Ok cool. You think its ready now? Cook it, blend it, taste test... adjust... blend more, food mill it, bottle it?
 
edit: The mold has been there but not expanding, for at little over 2 weeks. Still think its ok?
 
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Try using a cabbage leaf for holding mash below the brine worked great on my ferments. Used the heavily ribbed outer leaf and tuck around mash I use wine in all my ferments and combined with the cabbage leaf never had any yeast or mold cabbage seems to be a natural inhibitor. Lesson learned from the great people of thp. :)
 
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yeah i think i read on here that the cabbage has a lot of water in it and breaks down quickly giving a major boost to the LAB development. 
 
I'm definitely going to use something to hold the mash down under the brine next time. 
 
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Looks good a little yeast development but that's not a problem. Next one as long as your mash is below the brine you'll have a nice clean ferment. This one is working great. Nice job. Your on your way to fermentation nirvana. :)
 
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