12-4-8 vs. 10-10-10

HwyBill

Banned
I was at the store today because I needed to pick up some more fertilizer.
 
I usually use Miracle Gro Plant Food liquid concentrate that is 12-4-8.  I saw they had a new brand that I wasn't familiar with, and when I checked out the specs it said it was 10-10-10.
 
My knowledge of fertilizers is not sophisticated enough to know which I think would be preferable.
 
Any thoughts or advice?
 
I believe more the first would be better for vegetative growth before blooming (when you want high-low-low) and the second is better during blooming when you want low-high-high (but maybe too much N?)  I was wondering about this myself because I found some 20-20-20 I can mix light but maybe it is too much Nitrogen during blooming and pod growing...
 
20-N is to much for the bloom fruit stage unless you would rather have more vegitative growth than flowers and fruit.
 
All I know is your soil won't thank you for pouring that high analysis artificial fertiliser onto it. You are basically sterilising the soil using that ...no microbes or beneficials left ...
 
for best flowering and fruit production during season try to have somthign with bigger 2 last numbers...   like 8 12 12   the first one is for folialge and at that period you dont want too much of  foliage you want flowers and pods...
 the second number is usually associated with root system
 
 
check for tomato fetiliser usually thay have the same good stuff that pepper love and help a lot with fruiting and pods.
 
My 2 cents
 
Hammerfall said:
for best flowering and fruit production during season try to have somthign with bigger 2 last numbers...   like 8 12 12   the first one is for folialge and at that period you dont want too much of  foliage you want flowers and pods...
 the second number is usually associated with root system
 
 
check for tomato fetiliser usually thay have the same good stuff that pepper love and help a lot with fruiting and pods.
 
My 2 cents
 
Most of them are over-winters, so I believe they have pretty good, established root system.   I would like them to veg out a little bit more... they have room to do so (5 gal. buckets), but they are currently lush and producing pods.
 
The only way to know for sure what fertilizer you need is with a soil sample or three. Anything else is just guesswork. That said, I would not worry about the ratios of fertilizer as much as the sources and what minor and trace elements it contains. Cheap fertilizer is cheap for a reason. Quality fertilizer is expensive for a reason. Get 100% coated controlled release complete fertilizer like Dynamite and you don't have to worry about fert burn, washout, or leaching.  
 
Trippa said:
All I know is your soil won't thank you for pouring that high analysis artificial fertiliser onto it. You are basically sterilising the soil using that ...no microbes or beneficials left ...
http://organiclifestyles.tamu.edu/soil/microbeindex.html#faq5
 
 
Frequently we see statements in the lay literature about chemical fertilizers killing soil microbes or, worse yet, statements indicating these management inputs "sterilize" the soil. Statements such as these should be viewed with much skepticism! Remember that as we learned in FAQ #1, the soil can contain tons of microbes. Short of incineration its hard to imagine a stress in a soil that would lead to complete extermination of the microbial populations. It is true that some inputs, e.g., anhydrous ammonia, cause reductions in microbial numbers in the immediate vicinity of the application. After all, ammonia is a toxic gas. However, it quickly equilibrates with the soil solution in the form of ammonium ions and the toxicity subsides. Certain pesticides have been shown to cause similar transient reductions in selected microbial population. But remember, in some cases the microbes simply view these chemicals as food and degrade them fairly quickly.
 
Organic fertilizers circumvent the criticisms leveled at "synthetic" fertilizers but it should not be forgotten that plants take up nitrogen in the form of ammonium (NH4+) or nitrate (NO3-) ions regardless of whether it was mineralized from an organic source or applied as in inorganic fertilizer like ammonium nitrate. An advantage of using organics, where practical, is that nutrients are liberated slowly as the microbes mineralize the organic materials. Thus there is low risk for fertilizer burn on plants and less risk for environmental problems due to runoff and leaching. Another potentially negative effect of long-term use of ammonia-based fertilizers is soil acidification due to ammonia oxidation by the nitrifying bacteria. Soil pH can drop below 5.0 after prolonged use of ammonia-based fertilizers and this can cause marked reductions in populations of bacteria and actinomycetes and simultaneous increases in the relative abundance of fungi. Such changes might favor the development of certain fungal plant pathogens. On the other hand, the potato scab disease is reduced by the low pH because the actinomycete which causes it is eliminated. These changes are easily reversed with applications of lime to the soil. Thus we see qualitative changes in the soil populations due to some management inputs but this is a long way from "sterilizing" or "killing" the soil.
 
 
 
Peppers don't need much for nutrients anyways, let nature do it's damn thing! I'm all organic and half whatever they say to use. Never have I had a noticable deficiency.
I'm starting to educate myself on tea, definitely see the benefits! I want to start using rainwater as well, I know many people who swear by nothing but rain water and get phenomenal results. Depending on where you live I'm sure...
 
thegreenman said:
I said basically sterilise the soil. But anyway.
Here I will rephrase ... 'They will degrade your natural soil microbes and in the long term degrade it to a much reduced life state so as to acidify it to a point of not supporting many types of plants or allow the full spectrum of nutrients to be available to the plants."
Do they add anything good to a healthy soil (or unhealthy one) ... In the short term they add nutrients to the plants but not the soil.
In the long term they degrade a soil so as to require constant reapplication of the same artificial ferts ... Not a coincidence because this means more money in their pockets. Layman's terms or not you can't sugar coat it
 
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