I ran into this looking at some Fluorogrow units that AlphaHydroponics sells and ended up at the FG site to discover this lighting technology. Its not exactly new, but its using high power magnets to excite the mercury molecules and produce UV light that reacts with some kind of phosphorous coating to produce visible light. A 400w induction unit is supposed to produce more than twice the PAR that of HID and lasts longer than a LED. It sounds too good to be true because the configuration gets penetration, produces about temps of about 80f and requires no cooling units to keep it safe. Its also supposed to have extremely good penetration and coverage. They seem to be aiming at commercial production. The units are not cheap, but the bulb is supposed to last 100k hours. They sell the units based on PAR, and some of them claim 400 Par (and that is A LOT) but dont get into which spectrums it covers. Its supposed to be a wideband light.
-
Do you need help identifying a 🌶?
Is your plant suffering from an unknown issue? 🤧
Then ask in Identification and Diagnosis.
Anyone using or seen an induction light?
- Thread starter megahurts
- Start date
My hydro store has them and they are really cool but way above my lighting budget!
I LOVE LAMP! But not even Jay and Shags have been able to tell me how magnets work.
I'm not sure why they're so expensive, there are far more parts to building hid or even led components. I'm sure this will come way down in price over the next couple of years. If it can produce that much par, I wonder if you can get a sunburn.
These things start in the $500.00 range and go up to about 1600 from what I've seen. I'm sure there is a massive markup. They're not really that different than fluros in construction materials or process. The only difference is the magnet. Watch the guy pick up the lamps as he turns them off. I cant even do that when replacing CFLs in my ceiling fan. Even my LED fixture produces enough heat to require fans. That alone is amazing with the induction. Unfortunately and unlike LED, you cant really diy these but I seriously think they'll replace all HID lights if they're producing 200 par with one fixture consuming less than 400w.
I'm not sure why they're so expensive, there are far more parts to building hid or even led components. I'm sure this will come way down in price over the next couple of years. If it can produce that much par, I wonder if you can get a sunburn.
These things start in the $500.00 range and go up to about 1600 from what I've seen. I'm sure there is a massive markup. They're not really that different than fluros in construction materials or process. The only difference is the magnet. Watch the guy pick up the lamps as he turns them off. I cant even do that when replacing CFLs in my ceiling fan. Even my LED fixture produces enough heat to require fans. That alone is amazing with the induction. Unfortunately and unlike LED, you cant really diy these but I seriously think they'll replace all HID lights if they're producing 200 par with one fixture consuming less than 400w.
Hey Folks, thought i would chime in. Based upon all of the feedback we have received, the induction lamps work well. All of our experiences with Fluorogrow have been positive, that is why we continue to carry their products. We have not however, conducted independent measured experiments for PAR, life of the lamp, or power use using induction lamps. So, we must defer to other sources for specific stats.
Cost: Yes, induction lamps are expensive now, but so is an I phone 5 or 6 or whatever version they are on now (not to mention the monthly bills). I still have an old school phone with a real keyboard made by samsung and it cost about $100. I will replace it when it is toast (very soon), but it has served me well for at least 4 years. It lasted that long because it was built well. Early adoption of newly introduced technology (often field specific) will almost always carry a premium to the prior version or application. Drive it til the wheels fall off.
There was a manufacturer selling "plasma" grow lamps "Guaranteed for life" a few years ago.... I guess that was about 2 years, cause they are no longer in business. We never bothered to market them.
We still grow with hps, mh, t5 and led when and where appropriate. We also have a greenhouse, multiple hydro systems and several outdoor beds that require no supplemental light or electricity. Combining available tech and all the goodness of Mother Nature, allows us to grow year round, and even add a "season" if you will, by overlapping grow cycles. It is also a great hedge against harsh environmental conditions such as storms, drought or pests. That is money back in the pocket of commercial growers with an appropriate economy of scale. It does make sense for many to make this type of investment.
So, should a hobby grower in Florida buy an induction lamp to grow a few hot pepper plants before moving them outdoors?... perhaps not. But proliferation of a technology that works, tends to get better, more efficient and cheaper with time.
Just for the record... Margins aren't always what you'd think... despite the retail/ sticker price on some items, after labor, overhead, advertising expenses, coupons,theft, fraud, dead inventory, discounts etc., most folks (dealers) would be happy with 15-20%. That is what you tip for good service at a decent restaurant. So at the very least, we hope we always deliver good service.
I will step off my soapbox now....
Regards, Chris
Cost: Yes, induction lamps are expensive now, but so is an I phone 5 or 6 or whatever version they are on now (not to mention the monthly bills). I still have an old school phone with a real keyboard made by samsung and it cost about $100. I will replace it when it is toast (very soon), but it has served me well for at least 4 years. It lasted that long because it was built well. Early adoption of newly introduced technology (often field specific) will almost always carry a premium to the prior version or application. Drive it til the wheels fall off.
There was a manufacturer selling "plasma" grow lamps "Guaranteed for life" a few years ago.... I guess that was about 2 years, cause they are no longer in business. We never bothered to market them.
We still grow with hps, mh, t5 and led when and where appropriate. We also have a greenhouse, multiple hydro systems and several outdoor beds that require no supplemental light or electricity. Combining available tech and all the goodness of Mother Nature, allows us to grow year round, and even add a "season" if you will, by overlapping grow cycles. It is also a great hedge against harsh environmental conditions such as storms, drought or pests. That is money back in the pocket of commercial growers with an appropriate economy of scale. It does make sense for many to make this type of investment.
So, should a hobby grower in Florida buy an induction lamp to grow a few hot pepper plants before moving them outdoors?... perhaps not. But proliferation of a technology that works, tends to get better, more efficient and cheaper with time.
Just for the record... Margins aren't always what you'd think... despite the retail/ sticker price on some items, after labor, overhead, advertising expenses, coupons,theft, fraud, dead inventory, discounts etc., most folks (dealers) would be happy with 15-20%. That is what you tip for good service at a decent restaurant. So at the very least, we hope we always deliver good service.
I will step off my soapbox now....
Regards, Chris
I wonder what the reach on these is. my 1,000 watt HPS only effectively reaches 6-8 feet - that's with 150,000 lumens... according to what I've been able to find, these induction lights only put out 80 lumens per watt -- so @ 1000 watts they put out 80,000 lumens - It seems I would have to run ~ 2000 watts worth of induction lighting to put out as many lumens as my 1,000 watt HPS bulb. I don't really know much about lighting - as if that wasn't already obvious) but to me that would equate to a much shorter reach / less potent light per watt.. - I know they create less heat so getting them closer wouldn't burn the plant, but it does limit how many plants you can fit under one of these bulbs... -- with my current understanding (mostly misguided and misinformed) I would have to buy 4,000 watts worth of induction lighting to replace my 2,000 watt HPS set up... -- roughly $8,500 to do so -- YIKES!!! lol..
I do think these lights have a lot of potential ... once the price drops..... lol -- cool post, btw - I leaned about something new - thanks!
I do think these lights have a lot of potential ... once the price drops..... lol -- cool post, btw - I leaned about something new - thanks!
Well from my understanding (or what I've been reading lately and have been told by my local hydro owner) is that lumens and kelvin are not a valid way of deciding how much light you need to grow. I was told that the PAR (photosynthetically active radiation) reading of a light is the measurement that should be used in determining a lights ability.
For example, your 1000 watt light might be putting out 150,000 lumens but that's not to say that a light putting out 80,000 lumens cannot work just as well or better because it might have a higher PAR and therefore be putting out as much or more useable light than the HID.
I'm still learning....it's a lot to learn if you want to get serious about it. Otherwise stick with what works
For example, your 1000 watt light might be putting out 150,000 lumens but that's not to say that a light putting out 80,000 lumens cannot work just as well or better because it might have a higher PAR and therefore be putting out as much or more useable light than the HID.
I'm still learning....it's a lot to learn if you want to get serious about it. Otherwise stick with what works
Interesting... it's a lot to take in all at once... It seems rather difficult to find accurate / unbiased information... I'm having difficulty finding much on any induction lights actual par rating - other than it very good? lol...
I was able to find a couple charts that I don't quite understand:
I was able to find a couple charts that I don't quite understand:
I like that flurogro uses fulham ballasts. They seem to like quality parts. I've been trying to steer clear of most Chinese products.
The lumens / foot candle have a selling point for the industrial applications for this light because its very cost effective for the volume of output. You want to know the lumens to light a tunnel, parking lot, etc. This is where the market for these lights is righ tnow. However, the restrictive factor wont be the cost, it will be the footprint because its limited to shapes that can be made with glass. A LED has no shape, it can be configured for almost anything. Its downfall is that its so specific in wavelength, you end up light mixing with high powered chips to the point that you need supplemental cooling.
The induction light is a more advanced fluro thats bigger. Its a wide spectrum light like other fluros and moreso than hps. If a regular fluro was 400w, it would do the same thing. I think the induction method is whats allowing them to drive the gasses harder (my guess) and this produces more light. They're all filled with mercury and argon (usually) Considering all of the tubes are Chinese made because they were on an initiative to use them as industrial and public lighting, they'll come down in price. It appears that they're being made by just a few companies. It looks like the "agriculture" fixture resellers are slinging the exact same things out there. I dont think there is a specific bulb that is truly designed for horticulture. Can you really tell by looking at it?
No, I dont think the cost to benefit will work out right now and my peppers, etc go out the doors once the frost threat is gone. I just do this stuff for my summer garden hobby but one day, these induction lights will be as cheap as regular fluros. For the money, I'd be better off buying a small greenhouse. ...But, at that brightness, I'd like to install some in my garage and outside my garage. Check the comparison below, its somewhat interesting. The cost is prolly high because the life is so long. Marketing is trying to make up for its durability.
http://www.electriciantalk.com/f8/400w-induction-lights-replacing-1-000w-metal-halide-41341/
The lumens / foot candle have a selling point for the industrial applications for this light because its very cost effective for the volume of output. You want to know the lumens to light a tunnel, parking lot, etc. This is where the market for these lights is righ tnow. However, the restrictive factor wont be the cost, it will be the footprint because its limited to shapes that can be made with glass. A LED has no shape, it can be configured for almost anything. Its downfall is that its so specific in wavelength, you end up light mixing with high powered chips to the point that you need supplemental cooling.
The induction light is a more advanced fluro thats bigger. Its a wide spectrum light like other fluros and moreso than hps. If a regular fluro was 400w, it would do the same thing. I think the induction method is whats allowing them to drive the gasses harder (my guess) and this produces more light. They're all filled with mercury and argon (usually) Considering all of the tubes are Chinese made because they were on an initiative to use them as industrial and public lighting, they'll come down in price. It appears that they're being made by just a few companies. It looks like the "agriculture" fixture resellers are slinging the exact same things out there. I dont think there is a specific bulb that is truly designed for horticulture. Can you really tell by looking at it?
No, I dont think the cost to benefit will work out right now and my peppers, etc go out the doors once the frost threat is gone. I just do this stuff for my summer garden hobby but one day, these induction lights will be as cheap as regular fluros. For the money, I'd be better off buying a small greenhouse. ...But, at that brightness, I'd like to install some in my garage and outside my garage. Check the comparison below, its somewhat interesting. The cost is prolly high because the life is so long. Marketing is trying to make up for its durability.
http://www.electriciantalk.com/f8/400w-induction-lights-replacing-1-000w-metal-halide-41341/
yeah these charts are hard to understand without knowing exactly what those PAR numbers they are listing, represent.
I don't think I will ever use induction lighting due to the fact that they run off of vaporized mercury...I mean what happens if you bust one of them while they are on? Does that send vaporized mercury into the air? I sure as hell don't want to be around when that happens.
I don't think I will ever use induction lighting due to the fact that they run off of vaporized mercury...I mean what happens if you bust one of them while they are on? Does that send vaporized mercury into the air? I sure as hell don't want to be around when that happens.
Unless you own serious stock in incandescent light bulbs, the mercury factor can't be avoided. Fluro/CFLs use mercury vapor to produce the UV that reacts with the coating to produce whatever band of light that its engineered for. If broken, it dissipates into the air or collects on the ground like a thermometer.
Most of the research and trials will definitely come from the other kind of growers, since it seems to be the target market for starting any new lighting technology. I checked out some of the NSFW stuff at home to see what people had to say and they're impressed with it over LED/HID. I haven't seen where anyone has commented on real vegatbles and their taste, but most people growing tomatos arent going to invest 500 in a light like this.
What I'd like to see are real par readings at distances of 12/24/36/48 inches. Considering what people are claiming and seeing the manufacturing process, this is something much easier to make and will become the dominant fixture and its already home-based in China LOL. For once, I'd like to see them produce something that people actually desire to use.
Most of the research and trials will definitely come from the other kind of growers, since it seems to be the target market for starting any new lighting technology. I checked out some of the NSFW stuff at home to see what people had to say and they're impressed with it over LED/HID. I haven't seen where anyone has commented on real vegatbles and their taste, but most people growing tomatos arent going to invest 500 in a light like this.
What I'd like to see are real par readings at distances of 12/24/36/48 inches. Considering what people are claiming and seeing the manufacturing process, this is something much easier to make and will become the dominant fixture and its already home-based in China LOL. For once, I'd like to see them produce something that people actually desire to use.