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Basement "Grow Room" Planning

like I stated before I purchased a 1,000 watt off c-list only a few months old for 125 bucks {switchable hps/mh}, for the area you have in mind a 1,000 on a 6' mover would be perfect, and you would save on the additional heaters you where thinking of with strategic timing of the light cycle, mine heats the house, and the room stays 72 degrees constant
 
im sitting on t8's, 125 watt cfl, and a 400 watt hid, because I resisted going up, I should have just got the 1,000 to begin with, fans I just took a 25 dollar osculating hung it from the ceiling using bungee cords to cut down on vibration, then added a few cheap fans on the floor , works perfect  
 
been doing it since 1989
 
pepperdan said:
like I stated before I purchased a 1,000 watt off c-list only a few months old for 125 bucks {switchable hps/mh}, for the area you have in mind a 1,000 on a 6' mover would be perfect, and you would save on the additional heaters you where thinking of with strategic timing of the light cycle, mine heats the house, and the room stays 72 degrees constant
 
im sitting on t8's, 125 watt cfl, and a 400 watt hid, because I resisted going up, I should have just got the 1,000 to begin with, fans I just took a 25 dollar osculating hung it from the ceiling using bungee cords to cut down on vibration, then added a few cheap fans on the floor , works perfect  
 
been doing it since 1989
 
Awesome. Fans I can do.. So long as they spin and rotate a bit they can do wonders.
 
Mind if I quote you on that when I speak with the supplier next and see what they think/can do in regards to that? :)
 
theliveculture said:
Don't think a supplier is going to take you seriously if you mention craigslist and wholesale in the same sentence.
 
Fair point.. though I'm only going to be looking for the product, not to match the pricing. The guy would just laugh and laugh if I try that. lol
 
It's been some time since I've been in Bluenose country, Westville is near Pictou correct?? Because there used to be a GREAT hydroponics shop in Pictou that had a better selection of supplies than anything in Toronto at that time & much better prices. Helped a friend set up a grow space in Shubenacadie (10+years ago), I'll e-mail him to find out the name, but it was run by a couple of older ladies (hippies) in the basement of a motorcycle dealership ( I keep wanting to say Toad's cycle but I think that was in Halifax). The only other shop I remember being worth a damn was in Wolfville although I'm sure allot more have popped up. My friend still grows indoors so I'll ask him if he knows anywhere else, but he most likely buy's on-line nowadays.
 
Chris Kewley said:
It's been some time since I've been in Bluenose country, Westville is near Pictou correct?? Because there used to be a GREAT hydroponics shop in Pictou that had a better selection of supplies than anything in Toronto at that time & much better prices. Helped a friend set up a grow space in Shubenacadie (10+years ago), I'll e-mail him to find out the name, but it was run by a couple of older ladies (hippies) in the basement of a motorcycle dealership ( I keep wanting to say Toad's cycle but I think that was in Halifax). The only other shop I remember being worth a damn was in Wolfville although I'm sure allot more have popped up. My friend still grows indoors so I'll ask him if he knows anywhere else, but he most likely buy's on-line nowadays.
 
Yup, Westville is nestled in beside both New Glasgow & Stellarton. Pictou is about a 20 minute drive away from the rest of the main towns in the county. I was actually speaking with a place called Harris & Roome today, in New Glasgow, and the guy there said that there was a Hydroponics shop here in Pictou County up until last year. He said it was an older couple and the husband passed away last year and it's since closed out.
 
Of what he said, the next closest Hydroponic shop to us is in Truro. I mentioned pepperdan's advice regarding the 1,000w HID's to the guy and he rounded up some numbers and said between them and the place in Truro I ought to be able to put together the setup for around $200-300. He also said that he has his own setup at home and suggested that I won't even need spatial heaters - even in the winter - because of the heat the HID would put off. He said I'd likely have to setup ventilation to blow some of the heat -out- of the room. He showed me the bulb.. and yup. Those are quite the beasts. lol
 
Great to see someone else on here that knows a bit about my area. :)
 
Of what I understand from both NOBL and the local Planning Commission, if I manage to start a commercial greenhouse it'll essentially be about the only year-round one in the whole county. That would kinda awesome. A bit like setting the groundwork to hopefully encourage others to do the same.
 
Chris Kewley said:
It's been some time since I've been in Bluenose country, Westville is near Pictou correct?? Because there used to be a GREAT hydroponics shop in Pictou that had a better selection of supplies than anything in Toronto at that time & much better prices. Helped a friend set up a grow space in Shubenacadie (10+years ago), I'll e-mail him to find out the name, but it was run by a couple of older ladies (hippies) in the basement of a motorcycle dealership ( I keep wanting to say Toad's cycle but I think that was in Halifax). The only other shop I remember being worth a damn was in Wolfville although I'm sure allot more have popped up. My friend still grows indoors so I'll ask him if he knows anywhere else, but he most likely buy's on-line nowadays.
 
"Greenfield Grow and Brew" appears to be the one Hydroponic shop in Truro. And then the Halifax-area has a couple including "Steve's Hydroponics Equipment".
 
Both of these appear to carry more advanced HID's than the ones that Harris & Roome had to offer, albeit far more expensive. The H&R bulbs are huge & bulbous, compared to these websites that have 1000w bulbs that are more streamlined.
 
The question would be: Which would be the best to go with? I noticed from taking a quick look at some of the manufacturer websites, the 1000w bulbs come in range where some give off far more lumens than others, but also hit on different areas of the colour spectrum.
 
Super Hots Canada said:
 
"Greenfield Grow and Brew" appears to be the one Hydroponic shop in Truro. And then the Halifax-area has a couple including "Steve's Hydroponics Equipment".
 
Both of these appear to carry more advanced HID's than the ones that Harris & Roome had to offer, albeit far more expensive. The H&R bulbs are huge & bulbous, compared to these websites that have 1000w bulbs that are more streamlined.
 
The question would be: Which would be the best to go with? I noticed from taking a quick look at some of the manufacturer websites, the 1000w bulbs come in range where some give off far more lumens than others, but also hit on different areas of the colour spectrum.
 
 
Are you asking about the difference between metal halide bulbs and High pressure sodium? It is hard to tell from how the question was worded but if you are, here is my $.02. 
 
Using really rough numbers, MH is 100 lumens/watt and HPS is about 150 lumens/watt. MH bulbs give off light in the blue spectrum and are the bigger of the bulbs you see. HPS bulbs give off red spectrum light and are the streamlined bulbs. 
 
HPS is more efficient for peppers because they are color neutral unlike other plants. I personally use MH because of no other reason than the red light not the easiest thing to walk into every evening and pictures suck in the red light. I have both bulbs though and have been known to change for no particular reason. 
 
Jeff H said:
 
 
Are you asking about the difference between metal halide bulbs and High pressure sodium? It is hard to tell from how the question was worded but if you are, here is my $.02. 
 
Using really rough numbers, MH is 100 lumens/watt and HPS is about 150 lumens/watt. MH bulbs give off light in the blue spectrum and are the bigger of the bulbs you see. HPS bulbs give off red spectrum light and are the streamlined bulbs. 
 
HPS is more efficient for peppers because they are color neutral unlike other plants. I personally use MH because of no other reason than the red light not the easiest thing to walk into every evening and pictures suck in the red light. I have both bulbs though and have been known to change for no particular reason. 
 
That wasn't quite the question I -thought- I was asking, but it does clarify a lot - so thank you! :)
 
I apparently had myself a bit confused and was thinking that the 1000w HPS bulbs were simply a more condensed version of the 1000w MH bulbs. *shakes his head* Forgive me, I can be a bit daft at times. lol
 
So, if one such as this: http://www.eyehortilux.com/products/hps/PerformanceSpecs/lu1000bhtlen/66785 were an option for me to purchase in my area, would it potentially be a good choice?
 
I'm not too concerned about how pictures will turn out - I have over 10 years experience as a graphic designer under my belt. I just care about finding the best solution for my limited bucks. lol
 
Super Hots Canada said:
 
That wasn't quite the question I -thought- I was asking, but it does clarify a lot - so thank you! :)
 
I apparently had myself a bit confused and was thinking that the 1000w HPS bulbs were simply a more condensed version of the 1000w MH bulbs. *shakes his head* Forgive me, I can be a bit daft at times. lol
 
So, if one such as this: http://www.eyehortilux.com/products/hps/PerformanceSpecs/lu1000bhtlen/66785 were an option for me to purchase in my area, would it potentially be a good choice?
 
I'm not too concerned about how pictures will turn out - I have over 10 years experience as a graphic designer under my belt. I just care about finding the best solution for my limited bucks. lol
 
 
That is a pricey bulb. I don't know much about particular bulb brands, but it is probably a lot like computer parts. You pay a heck of a premium for the absolute best. If you are willing to settle for almost the best, you can get it for a lot less. 
 
My set up is only 600 watts so I'm sure prices are different but my best MH bulb was $50.00-60 or so. 
 
i wouldn't over think the bulbs too much, you can pay 258 dollars for the ultimate spectrum blue bulb that best imitates the spectrum of the equator but only produces 90 lumens per watt, you can buy double bulbs with both hp and mh, in reality i can go get a 1,000 watt mh for 42 dollars at a local hardware store made by ge, or go pay 90 at a grow store at 110 lms per watts, {hps is 140}
 
better tips are BU stands for base up HOR stands for horizontal not horticulture, universal is for both, but the least efficient
 
conversion bulbs are least efficient, buy the bulb that best fits the system
 
 
 
i have a switchable dual ballast i find it helpful to swap them out every 2 weeks, each time i change i get a boost in flowers and growth
 
i have heard the non color idea about spectrum, but go back to elemtary school and remember what is needed to make chloryphyl
 
 
 
and wear gloves when handling the bulbs
 
 
and wear gloves when handling the bulbs
 Something you usually learn AFTER burning in your first set of oily prints on a bulb. ;)
 
And then wondering why the bugger didn't last.
 
southerncanada said:
I think your on the right track going HID and getting both heat and light from the same source. Good luck with building your room and
future business.
 
Thanks.. I even came across a page on our (monopoly-tyrant) power company's where you can get an estimate of how much the electricity will cost based on the wattage you are using. I'm apparently looking at around $80/month for 3 T8 fluorescent fixtures and a 1000w HID.
 
Gotrox said:
 Something you usually learn AFTER burning in your first set of oily prints on a bulb. ;)
 
And then wondering why the bugger didn't last.
 
 
Just be grateful the bulb didn't explode! Ive read stories of some metal halide globes exploding due to the oils on the glass. I bought a MH the other day and had to handle it with my fingers and also wasn't sure if the seller had touched it, so I wiped it down with alcohol glass cleaners to ensure nothing was on the surface. If the bulb burns out early, so be it, I just don't want to pick little pieces of glass from my or anyone else!
 
Theres new MH bulbs these days too which are dual glassed. They have a separate glass frame on the inside and a bigger one on the outside, these are more user friendly, from what I've read.
 
None the less a MH is great for vegetative growth while the HPS is great for flowering but being chilli we focus on, you can get away with running purely off a MH globe, plus its easier on the eyes and doesn't look so drug den like lol.
 
There is a formula on calculating the exact cost of bills, sounds about right $80 for the MH 1kw bulb. Those T8's will consume a bees dick in comparison lol, hence another reason why I'm avoiding the MH I bought. Not gonna pay for light when I can use the sun for free.
 
Chris Kewley provided me with some links to online shops (thanks!), and from the ones I looked through looks like this is the best bet of the ones I saw (that I could get): http://www.hydroshop.ca/en/grow-lights/growing-lamps/hps-grow-bulbs/lightspeed-1000w-hps-grow-light-limited-edition.html - It claims to cover more of the spectrum where the others appear to focus on just flowering.
 
I'm still awaiting money to come in, which gives me plenty time to work out just what I'd need. And once it does come in I'll have around $750 to work, altogether, building material. (to give an idea of my limitations at the current time)
 
If I could pick up two of these 1000w HPS while they were on sale, would it be too much heat for the room to handle? - Keeping in mind that it can reach as low as -22 to -31 F during our winters, although our basement may prove a few degrees warmer. My thought would be to have one on a moving system (if I could figure out an affordable solution) where the majority of the plants would be along the top wall (in the diagram) and the other maybe stationary, above the door (bottom wall in the diagram) to help with ambiance.
 
(( *cough* I do realize that I'm pretty naive to all of this, but I learn by exploring and asking when I haven't got the material to learn hands-on lol ))
 
Basement-Schematic-blank.jpg

 
I'm also wrestling with how I might save on the construction while balancing the heat level of the room. I would love to go with something like "Mylar film" for the walls, but in the winter - when the lights are off - the "room" would likely lose the heat pretty damn fast. I had been considering building a ceiling for the room, just below the basement ceiling (as there are water pipes that run along the space), but it may help with the dispelling the extra heat -and- with adding a bit more height, if I leave off the ceiling and work out a solution for connecting the lights to the basement ceiling and using reflective film to cover the area of the ceiling to help reflect the light down at the plants.
 
.....
 
Below is a screenshot of some items that I threw into the "shopping cart" on Hydroshop.ca to get an idea of the pricing I might be looking at if I went with the 2-HPS lights, with one on moving system (which I admittedly am pretty sure is going to take more than I've factored out so far lol):
 
shopping-cart-idea.jpg

 
 
Thoughts? :)
 
Thanks for all your feedback and being patient with me! :)
 
Jeff H said:
You can do it for cheaper if you buy one of the packages. You won't get the same quality of bulb, but they only hast a year or so anyway. You can get a better bulb once this one blows out.
 
http://www.virtualsunhydroponics.com/agricultural/products/VS1000TRMS.asp?CAWELAID=1544825636&cagpspn=pla&%22cagpspn=pla%22&gclid=COH0ldfDiroCFdAWMgodIS8ANg
 
For one of those it would run me around $130 for shipping. For 2, it's around $190.. I'd be looking at around $350 per, if I buy each individually from that site. So it's -definitely- cheaper..  I'd have to stick with just one light setup for the time being and save towards another. Though, I could still get one of the other bulbs I was looking at and use the bulb that comes with -this- as a spare. :)
 
Thanks for pointing out that website. :)
 
I wasn't really pointing out one specific website. I was trying to point out that there are package deals put out by a lot of shops that will give you everything you need in one package and you will get a better price. From what I have seen, there are super cheap packages from China all the way to $700 systems. You probably get what you pay for, but at least if you get a package, you will get a better deal then buying individual pieces.
 
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