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Coir + Perlite, why?

filmost

filmost

I notice most people here who use coco coir tend to mix perlite with it. Is there any particular reason? I was under the impression that the structure of the coir fibers was just right for drainage vs water holding capacity and so the addition of perlite for aeration would seem unnecessary. Am I wrong?
 
It just turbo charges it a little more...

And in any case.. I wouldnt recommend growing in pure coco coir... its always good to add in some perlite, vermiculite, and some compost and/or worm castings.  The coco is just the soil base*
 
Noah Yates said:
It just turbo charges it a little more...

And in any case.. I wouldnt recommend growing in pure coco coir... its always good to add in some perlite, vermiculite, and some compost and/or worm castings.  The coco is just the soil base*
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How about just for seed starting? I think I read somewhere it was suggested not to add compost or worm castings b/c it wasn't necessary to seed starting, and to add that to your mix after the plants get some leaves and you are ready to pot up.
 
At the moment  I just have pure coir mixed with a small packet of included starter nutes (10L of coir + a teeny tiny packet or powdered nutes). I did add some rootgrow to my cups before i planted the seeds. They all seem to be doing well at the moment. First leaves are starting to sprout.
 
filmost said:
 
May I inquire about your "recipe for success"?  :)
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I am a rookie compared to many here but if you can find my 2013 GLOG, check out the mix I made for my squarefoot garden. I use all kinds of compost and organic materials. 
 
Coco coir with nothing else is an awesome grow, but with one little caveat... You MUST use coir specific nutrients, and you must PH your water. (as the media is inert, as you know) At this point, it's truly a hydroponic grow. And the major drawback is that you will be using super expensive nutrients, and draining them to waste. It will grow most things better than just about anything available, as it has all of the advantages of both soil and hydro, but with almost none of the disadvantages of hydro. (reservoir gunk, wild PH swings, root rot, etc)

From what I have witnessed, 100% Coco coir, with coco nutes and SmartPots produces the most dramatic grows of anything out there, short of a well tuned hydroponic/aeroponic setup. However, due to the cost, it's really best suited to "cash" crops.

That's just my experience. I'm no expert. But I was impressed. :)
 
solid7 said:
Coco coir with nothing else is an awesome grow, but with one little caveat... You MUST use coir specific nutrients, and you must PH your water. (as the media is inert, as you know) At this point, it's truly a hydroponic grow. And the major drawback is that you will be using super expensive nutrients, and draining them to waste. It will grow most things better than just about anything available, as it has all of the advantages of both soil and hydro, but with almost none of the disadvantages of hydro. (reservoir gunk, wild PH swings, root rot, etc)

From what I have witnessed, 100% Coco coir, with coco nutes and SmartPots produces the most dramatic grows of anything out there, short of a well tuned hydroponic/aeroponic setup. However, due to the cost, it's really best suited to "cash" crops.

That's just my experience. I'm no expert. But I was impressed. :)
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Not bashing, just correcting a few things.  You don't HAVE to use coir specific nutrients nor do you HAVE to ph your water.  I've been growing certain plants in coir/perlite with GH Maxibloom and a little epsom salt and never phing.  Plants have grown to tremendous size and produced pounds of peppers off single plants in small 20oz cups.  But you need an idea of your water's content before blindly jumping in like I do.
 
Also, look up Pepperguru's grows from previous years and have a gander at the magnificence that good ole organic soil and teas do for a grow.  Pot size also helps.
 
No offense taken. Please note, I was referring to a coco coir + nothing grow.

The method that I was talking about involves no perlite, nothing more than Coco Coir and the coco specific nutes + additives. Like I said, it's really and truly a hydroponic grow. (requiring even the PH be adjusted in the water, as there is nothing to influence PH in the pot other than the nutrient solution) And I've never seen a better grow. I did look at Guru's grow, and I don't mean any disrespect - cause that's one hell of a crop - but the coco coir was a more rapid and bountiful grow. Again, no disrespect, because it's a different system, and it's not fair to compare the two. I respect Guru's grow on its own, without being compared to anything else, while appreciating the coco grow as an interesting innovation.

Personally, I can't fathom the upfront cost. I priced out the straight coco vs and organic grow, and upfront cost alone was at least 2X using the straight coco, + the expense of continually dumping nutrients into the system. A process which accelerates with the seasons and plant growth.

So, I'm doing an organic grow in SmartPots. :)
 
Lots of opinions on this. Some say it helps with aeration/nutrient retention while others say it does nothing other than mess with the perfect balance of air to water ratio that coco already possesses. I've only used pure coco so I can't comment one way or the other. All I know is that I've never had plants grow as fast in soil as they have in coco.

Neil
 
solid7 said:
No offense taken. Please note, I was referring to a coco coir + nothing grow.

The method that I was talking about involves no perlite, nothing more than Coco Coir and the coco specific nutes + additives. Like I said, it's really and truly a hydroponic grow. (requiring even the PH be adjusted in the water, as there is nothing to influence PH in the pot other than the nutrient solution) And I've never seen a better grow. I did look at Guru's grow, and I don't mean any disrespect - cause that's one hell of a crop - but the coco coir was a more rapid and bountiful grow. Again, no disrespect, because it's a different system, and it's not fair to compare the two. I respect Guru's grow on its own, without being compared to anything else, while appreciating the coco grow as an interesting innovation.

Personally, I can't fathom the upfront cost. I priced out the straight coco vs and organic grow, and upfront cost alone was at least 2X using the straight coco, + the expense of continually dumping nutrients into the system. A process which accelerates with the seasons and plant growth.

So, I'm doing an organic grow in SmartPots. :)
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I've also grown in coco without ph-ing my water. For about two months I fed the plants nothing and they've still grown. So this whole coco is inert/hydroponic thing I'm not so sure of... The plants I grew in coco were more productive and larger at the end of the season than the ones grown organically - they were also a lot cheaper to grow for me (I've used the bio-bizz line for organics and they can get expensive with all the additives and boosters).
 
Didn't notice much difference in plant growth with pure coco vs 50/50 coco and perlite. This year I'm growing in 50/50, though, because I found a source where I can get perlite for much cheaper than coco, so it's just economics.
 
ebh said:
I've also grown in coco without ph-ing my water. For about two months I fed the plants nothing and they've still grown. So this whole coco is inert/hydroponic thing I'm not so sure of...
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Did you actually buy a coco coir that was labelled inert? Or was ther anything else at all added to it? What stage of plant growth are you at? What is the PH of your water when you add it?

At just the most basic observation, there isn't any good reason why plain coco + nothing should do well. You must be creating some other ideal condition. It would be interesting to note, because for your success, there are dozens of failure stories, which have lead others to completely swear off of coco. (even though they didn't adhere to the prescribed method)
 
solid7 said:
Did you actually buy a coco coir that was labelled inert? Or was ther anything else at all added to it? What stage of plant growth are you at? What is the PH of your water when you add it?

At just the most basic observation, there isn't any good reason why plain coco + nothing should do well. You must be creating some other ideal condition. It would be interesting to note, because for your success, there are dozens of failure stories, which have lead others to completely swear off of coco. (even though they didn't adhere to the prescribed method)
Click to expand...
 
The plants I'm talking about were started in some kind of peat pellets (as seeds), then moved to cups with cheap potting soil if I remember correctly. After they outgrew those I put them in these:
https://www.growin.de/cocostar-coco-pot-kokoserde-9-l.html?___store=gi_sv_c_en&___from_store=gi_sv_c_de
 
Only gave them water because I found out those bags sucked big time. There was really poor drainage, no wholes in them and the coco was drenched at all times. Figured the plants were going to die eventually, so I just gave them water, not wanting to waste my nutes on them. After about a month the plants not only didn't die, they were outgrowing the others (who were in soil), so I figured they diserve to be taken care of properly.
 
Next thing, I moved them to 14l pots with bio-bizz coco: http://www.biobizz.com/us/products/organic-substrates/coco-mix mixed with perlite and started feeding them this cheap fertiliser: http://www.growthtechnology.com/product/chilli-focus/ at an aproximate dosage (never actually measured). After the bottle was done I got them some Canna Coco nutes (A+B type). For all this time I have NEVER measured or for that matter adjusted the PH. Regular tap water was used.
 
Both plants (they were 2 red habs) are now dead. They didn't like it indoors...
 
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