• If you have a question about commercial production or the hot sauce business, please post in Startup Help.

tutorial Fermenting Peppers 101

Welcome Chileface, canis (from Argentina! Sweet!), and Fatalalanus to THP! There's tons of great info here in THP and this fermenting thread is one of the best about fermented chiles/sauces.

Hope you all enjoy your time here on THP and we look forward to getting to know you.

salsalady
 
Thanks for this, I have a lot of habaneros that I've been wanting to turn into a legit hot sauce. My creations so far haven't been very good. I think I need to go the frementing route and I had no clue how to start until I read this thread.
 
Welcome follow Salsa Lady's link, both of these threads have great information. Not only on how to make some killer sauce but how to do it safely so you don't make yourself or others sick.
 
Any suggestions for sort-of inert, filler ingredients? The ripe chiles I have to work with—piquíns—are profoundly hot. Even seeded, a quart jar of these, I think, might be a bit savage. Green bell peppers can be pretty grassy tasting, so maybe orange, red, or yellow ones?

Other ideas for ingredients to create volume without added fire and with desirable or neutral flavours?

Ingredients I tentatively have in mind to flavour this sauce include:
  • Chile piquín
  • Apple fruit
  • Cider vinegar
  • Molasses
  • Onion
  • Persimmon (possibly)
  • Soy sauce
  • Tamarind.
A mix-and-taste test yesterday seemed very promising.
 
To create volume without adding any real flavors to a sauce is difficult because most anything you use is going to have something to add whether is be a touch of sweetness/saltiness, here were not adding any flavor but still changing the flavor profile. That said my go to ingredients for adding volume I also use to add some consistency to my sauces. I like a sauce that's abotu medium thick so it stays where I put it. I have used Carrots, Sweet Potatoes and not Pumpkin for that. I could also see using squash, like Butternut or Acorn, which sould not add much in the way of flavor to the sauce or what it would add would be covered over by the other ingredients like Onion and Garlic plus any fresh herbs that you might use.

The best suggestion would be to make a series of small batches trying alot of different things till you find what your looking for. That starts by having a good clear idea of the Flavor Profile, something I talk about alot, and then start imagining how an ingredient might move you towards or away from it. Also keep in mind that any sweetness you want in your sauce is going to have to be added post fermentation. If you add say some raisins to the sauce and ferment them your going to get the flavor of raisins in your sauce but not the sweetness of the raisins as the lactobacillius will have consumed the sugars.

So, time to allow your inner child to play in the kitchen while the outter adult keeps him safe with the knives.
Have fun.
RM
 
RocketMan - This thread is tremendously helpful, thank you! I’m a beginner and I started two very small fermentations going in two small pickle sized glass jars last month. I’m planning on letting them go for another month. Only thing I’d do different next time is try not to open the jars but it was too tempting. I was nervous too that the glass jars were under too much pressure. The fermentation would always pick back up, with the CO2 starting to flow after a day or two. Anyway, once I’m ready to make the sauce and after fermentation is complete, do I need to boil the sauce, the way it’s recommended on the first page of this thread? I’m planning on doing it that way and putting everything into a blender (seeds and all). I was just curious because I wasn’t sure if this is something necessary or something that is preferred, possibly for flavor? Do you blend the seeds as well or leave them out? Thank you again for this great thread.
 
What I do is:

Boil 20 min then reduce to simmer for 45 minutes
Blend the crud out of it, in batches if needed
Return to simmer 30 minutes
Blend the crud out of it again
Bring sauce to 195 degrees F for 15 minutes
Bottle reheating sauce if it gets below 185
Invert bottles and shake sauce down to cap, for 15 minutes.
 
. . . why after going to all the trouble and time of fermenting your wonderful chili concoctions you guys all seem to cook/kill all the life/pro-biotics you have so carefully grown...raw is the go, imo . . .
Click to expand...

. . . cooking the sauce . . . don’t like the bite of the raw.
Click to expand...


How about cooking first, pre-fermentation, for flavour purposes and not heating again in order to preserve the friendlies, the beneficial bacteria?
 
Honestly, I have never paid mush attention to whether fermenters blanch or cook their peppers prior to fermenting or not. I suppose that if your going to blanch them just to kill off any nasties you should do it to all the ingredients that are going into the jar however, I really don't see the need as we add salt to the mix to prevent them taking hold prior to the Lactobacillius getting started. As far as for flavor purposes the only way to affect the flavor would be to smoke them prior to fermenting. After that the only flavor additions are going to come from the other ingredients or whatever is added post fermentation.

RM
 
swellcat said:
How about cooking first, pre-fermentation, for flavour purposes and not heating again in order to preserve the friendlies, the beneficial bacteria?
Click to expand...

Much of this has to do with local process authority guidelines for food prep/sales. It's fine and all if you want to grow bacteria for your own concoctions but when you start getting into production/distribution, unless you do extensive lab tests on each and every batch to ensure you're only growing the bacteria you're after (expensive), pretty much your only choice to ensure you're not going to give everyone botulism is to cook the ever living crap out of it.
 
. . . U.S. Department of Agriculture research service microbiologist Fred Breidt says properly fermented vegetables are actually safer than raw vegetables . . .

"With fermented products there is no safety concern. I can flat-out say that. The reason is the lactic acid bacteria that carry out the fermentation are the world's best killers of other bacteria," says Breidt, who works at a lab at North Carolina State University, Raleigh, where scientists have been studying fermented and other pickled foods since the 1930s.

Breidt adds that fermented vegetables, for which there are no documented cases of food-borne illness, are safer for novices to make than canned vegetables.

— http://www.sfgate.co...p#ixzz2EODTeWIe
Click to expand...


Preserving Food with the Lactic-Acid Fermentation Method

Are Mason Jar Ferments Safe?

Debunking the Botulism Fear
 
I boiled my hot sauce a couple days ago and unfortunately I’m not pleased with the result. There’s something about the final product that’s just “off”. There's also no notiecable fruitiness to it. The heat is very nice and very even but the smell is just generally unpleasant. It has a similar aroma to the way it smelled during fermentation. By the way, I used a whey starter, from whole fat yogurt. I made the mistake of opening my glass jar during fermentation a few times to stir everything. Fermentation would eventually start back up but even then I noticed a not so pleasant aroma and stayed in the sauce even after boiling. Anyone have any ideas of what this could be? Did I use to much whey starter? I’m in the process of fermenting another batch and this time, because it’s the only thing I can think of, I’m not going to open the jar and I’m not going to stir. Maybe just skim the top off when I’m finished. Thanks guys.
 
CBills428 said:
I boiled my hot sauce a couple days ago and unfortunately I’m not pleased with the result. There’s something about the final product that’s just “off”. There's also no notiecable fruitiness to it. The heat is very nice and very even but the smell is just generally unpleasant. It has a similar aroma to the way it smelled during fermentation. By the way, I used a whey starter, from whole fat yogurt. I made the mistake of opening my glass jar during fermentation a few times to stir everything. Fermentation would eventually start back up but even then I noticed a not so pleasant aroma and stayed in the sauce even after boiling. Anyone have any ideas of what this could be? Did I use to much whey starter? I’m in the process of fermenting another batch and this time, because it’s the only thing I can think of, I’m not going to open the jar and I’m not going to stir. Maybe just skim the top off when I’m finished. Thanks guys.
Click to expand...

You let something in. I say it all the time. Once you close the jar up dont open it till it's time to process the sauce.

RM
 
CBills428 said:
I boiled my hot sauce a couple days ago and unfortunately I’m not pleased with the result. There’s something about the final product that’s just “off”. There's also no notiecable fruitiness to it. The heat is very nice and very even but the smell is just generally unpleasant. It has a similar aroma to the way it smelled during fermentation. By the way, I used a whey starter, from whole fat yogurt. I made the mistake of opening my glass jar during fermentation a few times to stir everything. Fermentation would eventually start back up but even then I noticed a not so pleasant aroma and stayed in the sauce even after boiling. Anyone have any ideas of what this could be? Did I use to much whey starter? I’m in the process of fermenting another batch and this time, because it’s the only thing I can think of, I’m not going to open the jar and I’m not going to stir. Maybe just skim the top off when I’m finished. Thanks guys.
Click to expand...

Did it smell sour or stinky/yeasty like a dumpster behind a bakery........sorry, ..... :eek: .......that reminded of a resturant I use to work at, there was a bakery next door and the old dough culture would get thrownout and ferment.......well lets just say it didn't smell like fresh baked Baklava...ha

Anyways, Bills right....again.....You let the air in.

When fermenting I never use a starter , its strictly ripe peppers off the plants, with an additional amount of salt in proportion to the weight of the peppers and a small amount of evaporated cane sugar. The salt will bring out the liquid from the peppers, the airlock on the vessel will let the gas escape, not letting air or bacteria in.
Theres no reason to remove the lid until the desired time period is over.I can see through the glass and I don't shake it up like a Christmas waterglobe to disperse the liquid (some may enter the airlock). The jar stays put in a dark closet...and theres no reason for an unpleasent smell when opened.

If you're using a starter the chance of building a crust of moldy yeast on the top layer increases and the possibility of growing unseen bacteria spindles throughout the ferment multiplies. Theres no safe duration when to stop or extend the process. I haven't used it before but there are powdered vegetable starters available with instructions on how to ferment.

I would suggest next time if possible to use a jar with an airlock and keep in mind, only use ripe not over ripened fruit. The chance of spoilage will decrease. Good luck on the next time around. The final ferment should have a mellow pleasent pepper scent. these are only my opinions.

Greg
 
My last batch came out pretty good. I didn’t open the jar at any point throughout fermentation and I’m happy with the result. I used all habaneros with carrots, ginger, onion, garlic and a few raisins. I let it ferment for about 30 days. I think next time I’ll go longer. I’m pretty happy with it considering it’s my first successful batch, especially compared to my batch that got spoiled due to opening it during fermentation. I think maybe I’m just not in love with an all habanero based hot sauce. Any opinions on this? Anyway, that’s my last batch until next year around this time. It’s painful to think but I can’t even start to think about growing until another 2-3 months. Thanks again for all the helpful feedback!
 
I've been jumping between homes the last 6 months, so i haven't been able to do proper follow ups on my thread, but my girlfriend gave me a book about fermenting veggies before i started the second one.

My thoughts on fermenting after two batches of hot sauce:

The first i did with a starter and the salt percentages indicated here. That one never really took off, only bubbled slowly and stopped after some time (it was super delicious tho!)

My second attempt was totally different. I studied what the lactobacillii wanted and how it acts. It's apparently two different versions that gets active if you don't use a starter. The first one loves a bit higher pH-values and a salt halt of about 1.5-2% (can do about 0.5-3.5% but slower) and is on and in almost every type of vegetable and chile (about 1ppm of all the bacteria in them). It will reproduce like crazy during the first two days and produce a lot of lactic acid to make a slightly lower pH-level and make the environment perfect for the second type. You won't even have to have the lid open, except to burp it.

My second batch with 2% salt in it and no started was bubbling away in about 12 hours. After four days the bubbling slowed down a bit when the second bacteria started liking it and after 9-10 days it started going a lot again.

I don't want to pretend to be a sudden expert in the subject after two sauce ferments, but after doing some other veggies too without starter and they got kickstarted in the same way, i believe that you don't need a starter and not that high amount of salt (just weigh everything including any added liquid and calculate salt percentages that way).

Any suggestions or ideas would be loved :)

/Philip
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top