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fermenting Fermenting smoked peppers?

F

FrogFan

Hi all,
 
I just got here a couple days ago and I've read the entire sauce making and fermenting threads, so I feel like I'm prepared to dive in.  I'd like to smoke/roast (not dry) my peppers before fermenting them.  I'm thinking that will kill the beneficial bacteria and hence require that I use a starter, but I thought I'd check with the experts first. 
 
The other option I seem to have come across in my travels over the internet is to hold out a few peppers and not smoke them, then blend the unroasted peppers -- and their beneficial bacteria -- into the mash and proceed to ferment with only salt.
 
Any advice?
 
Thanks!
 
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Thank you.  Yes, I saw that post and was wondering if anyone tried the "other" option I mentioned above, or if any of the beneficial bacteria would actually survive the smoke/roasting.  I'll get a starter and maybe try it both ways.
 
I plan to use marbles and cheesecloth to hold my mash down while fermenting.
 
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austin87 said:
http://thehotpepper.com/topic/60432-fermented-sauce-using-char-roasted-chillies/

This guy just did it. I also recently gave it a try and used a whey starter then a few days later added a probiotic capsule after I wasn't sure it was fermenting. I'm still not sure if it is fermenting but it's not rotting.

Mine is in a French press using the plunger to hold the mash below the liquid level.
Click to expand...
hmmm I never considered using a french press for fermenting. Have you used one before and been successful  ?
 
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SavinaRed said:
hmmm I never considered using a french press for fermenting. Have you used on before and been successful  ?
Click to expand...
It's my first ferment. I saw it in America's Test Kitchen "Made From Scratch" magazine that I picked up off the grocery store shelf a few years back.

https://www.amazon.com/Made-Scratch-Americas-Test-Kitchen/dp/B00HMG4HH2 - when I bought it I think it was $3.99

The thought process behind it is that the plunger holds the mash below the liquid level to keep the top layer from spoiling.
 
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I have fermented smoked peppers many time, yes with a whey starter. Haven't had a problem with it yet. Yep, the smoking/roasting will kill off the natural bacteria so a starter will be needed unless you use a combination of smoked/roasted and not.
 
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I love doing smoked ferments. As a general rule I use Probiotic capsules or as brother RocketMan stated use a mix of fresh and smoked. I've also added fresh smoked peppers to my finished ferments while processing. Some members have tried this product and seemed to like this flavor profile the best.
I believe SmokenFire said it was one of my best very complex flavors. This method gives a cleaner smoked flavor without the worries of getting your ferments to start. And really pops with great smoke flavor. My favorite method after trying both methods. Much cleaner flavor.
Cheers
 
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Thanks for all the helpful responses!  :)
 
I'm going to get started today.  I've been to the local market, and got a bunch of fresh peppers:  Jalapeno; serrano; fresno; anahaeim; habanero; and poblano.  I bought some of everything they had.  I will smoke/roast them this afternoon between dips in the pool (the temperature in Texas is fiery hot today!), then I'll chop them up in the food processor, add salt and starter (I haven't decided which way to go yet), and get the fermentation started (I have mason jars and airlocks, plus I'll use marbles and cheesecloth to weigh down the mash).  If I can figure out how, I'll post some pictures when things get going.
 
I know the target salt percentage is around 5% of the pepper weight with wild fermentation and a bit less if you use a starter, but I can't remember if there's a rule of thumb lower percentage.  If anyone has a number handy for that, I'd be interested.  Otherwise, I'll just go with 5%.
 
I'll also set some of the mash aside to make a fresh salsa that I'll refrigerate that my daughter and I can enjoy while we await the fermented product.
 
Thanks again for all the help!
 
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Just a quick update on where I am with my smoked pepper ferment.
 
I had about 500 grams of peppers, approximately equally distributed by weight among habaneros, poblanos, anaheims, fresnos, jalapenos, serrano, and thai chile (I found some of these at another market later in the day).  After smoking/roasting, I chopped all of them in the food processor with four cloves of roasted garlic.  I then set aside about 50 grams for some fresh salsa, to which I added a bit of salt and water and then processed through a food mill to remove seeds and skins.  The rest, about 450 grams, I set about fermenting.
 
I added about 20 grams of salt (just about 4 percent of the pepper weight) to the remaining mash and processed it again to mix the salt in.  I crushed two probiotic tablets, dissolved them in water and added the resulting solution and the salted mash to a mason jar.  I covered the mash with water and weighed it down with cheesecloth and marbles, so now I'm waiting for the ferment to start.  The mason jar is sealed with an airlock.
 
Meanwhile, I've tasted the fresh salsa.  It's very hot and smoky (I used hickory chips for the smoked flavor).  I like it a lot, but I think it could use a bit more salt (I used about one teaspoon for the 50 grams) and maybe a bit of sweetness for balance.  I also think the smoke flavor might be a bit overdone.  I'm going to see what my daughter thinks.
 
I expect the fermented salsa will taste quite different, but I'll need to wait a month or more to taste it.
 
I'd post a picture of the fermenting mash but I can't seem to figure out how to do that.
 
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Hi all,

Well, I resisted the temptation to taste the ferment and let it go until today.  (It's been 10 months.)  I thought I'd finish this thread off by describing the result.

I decided to use two pro-biotic capsules to start the ferment.  I did that to be safe, but I do want to try to use raw peppers next time to compare the results.  The mash began to ferment after a couple days.  It fermented very slowly, as most people have described here -- just a few bubbles per day, except at one point the mash bubbled into the airlock.  I didn't leave enough head space.  I had enough space to pull the airlock up a bit and let things continue.  No harm done, apparently, and things settled down for the past 10 months.

I noticed several months ago that I had some white deposits on the surface of the ferment.  I worried about them for awhile but decided to assume it was Kahm yeast, and to  quit worrying.  Today when I opened the jar, the white stuff was clinging to the cheesecloth, and when I took it and the marbles out, the white stuff came out with it.  I tested the ph of the fermented mash, and it was 3.0, so I pronounced it safe.  The mash had a fresh, if a bit odd, smell to it.  Probably just the smell of the lactic acid?

I processed the mash through a food mill but decided not to cook it, preferring to keep the beneficial bacteria around.  I did add a a small amount of water to loosen the mash up a bit, and when I got finished, the ph had risen to 3.1;  still well within the safe zone, if I'm interpreting the experts here correctly.  I plan to keep it in plastic "ketchup" bottles with the snap lid in my refrigerator.  I'm thinking the lids will pop off if fermentation continues, but I suspect after 10 months, that's finished.

Then I tasted it.  I couldn't believe how complex the flavor was!  The variety of peppers, the bit of garlic, the smokiness, and the fermentation combined to produce very big flavor.  The heat of the peppers was initially quite subtle, but came on strong after awhile and then lingered for longer than usual, I thought.  The fermentation really subdued the smoky flavor.  It's still present and obvious that the peppers were smoked, but the smoked flavor no longer dominates.  (My daughter hated the fresh mash.  It was far too smoky for her.  I'm hoping she'll enjoy this fermented batch.)

In summary, I highly recommend a smoked, fermented sauce.  The complexity of the flavors is really difficult to describe, but it's really enjoyable, and the heat doesn't smack you upside the head like it does with a fresh mash.  The mash tastes especially good on a salty chip.

Thanks to the experts here for the tips.
 
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