Hobby Sauce Maker arrested

[Weed]

Ya cuz the once a year inspection by "professionals" means they wipe the counter of rat feces every time.

 

[salsalady]

No, the 2-4 times a year (or more depending on what product is being made) inspection means there are no rats in the facility to begin with.

 

[Sm1nts2escape]

The difference is that a non-hobby (otherwise known as a "professional") saucemaker uses a licensed and inspected kitchen, produces a product as, or under the guidance of a certified kitchen manager or canner, and has their product inspected by their local process authority, along with having lot control for recall purposes and liability insurance in the event that any harm is done or perceived. Training, licensing, inspection & insurance coverage more than make the differences clear.
 

 
Pretty much said that in this sentence:
 

"I would say that buying from inspected/licensed kitchens is a little safer."
 

No offense but I find your "cutting corners for profit" comparison statement to be preposterous. A professional sauce maker may well "cut a corner" for profit - which means maybe using a less expensive vinegar or using a cayenne instead of a more expensive tepin, or switching salt companies.

The hobbiest "cutting corners" might mean not bothering to clean up the dead cat anf feces off of the kitchen counter before making sauce. Or something small like not washing their hands after taking a crap then heading right to the kitchen.
 

 
Manufacturers are getting busted daily for trying to cut corners. That's why people get e coli 90% of the time. Most recent I can think of is when burgerking got busted for putting diseased horse meat in their burger. About ten years or so ago Food Lion was busted for washing their spoiled meat with bleach to kill the bacteria then adding red dye to it to give it color again. I find your argument invalid. Also kitchens are not inspected daily. When I worked at a high end restaurant about 15 years ago the inspector came once a year.
 

I too support hobby sauce makers - I was one myself for the better part of 8 years until I launched my company. Not sure why you felt the need to assert that professionals have any less love for making hot sauce than hobbyists. If anything the opposite conclusion could be drawn - some people love hot sauce so much they make it their life's work despite significant hurdles, heaps of competition & and financial challenges.
 

 
I figured you use to be given the love you seem to show for your sauces. Don't forget where you came from. I never said professionals I said corporations/manufacturers. "Some people" can include hobby sauce makers..
 
 

Regardless, this particular hobbyist outlines the very real danger of purchasing a food product from someone who is making and selling illegally. While pretty extreme, and absolutely the "worst case scenario" it certainly provides an effective example of why there's risk. I feel awful for the reviewers/customers who've ingested anything made in those conditions. And worse still, that evil person may well have deliberately tampered with the sauces he sent out for some kind of sadistic pleasure.

 
I too feel bad for his customers but this happens at manufacturing facilities too. Remember the story a few years ago with the condom in the toothpaste? Why focus on the illegality of selling sauces as a hobby? You were once a hobby sauce maker selling illegal uncertified/inspected sauces as well right?
 
 

I'm not saying hobbyists are bad - no one is making the generalization that all hobbyists are like this guy. But you'd have to be nuts to not acknowledge the danger of eating something made by someone you don't know in conditions you're unaware of. And when you buy from a non-professional, (a hobbyist) that's exactly what you're doing. And with no liability coverage, good luck seeking recourse if the product made you sick.

 
Again I said: "I would say that buying from inspected/licensed kitchens is a little safer."
And: "People are taking a risk when buying any product they didn't make themselves, licensed or not. There is a common denominator and that is humans."
 
I feel like you are twisting my words AGAIN and I don't like it. I feel like some of these post are trying to scare the consumer into only buying sauces from "professional" sauce makers. I mean it's not like some of you have anything to gain by downing the avg joe hobby sauce maker or anything. Right? Sounds like politics in The Hot Pepper forums

 

[salsalady]

There are reports almost daily of problems in the food industry at all levels.  No one is saying there isn't and that all food service processors, restaurants, etc are good.  We all know that's not the case.  I saw a health report in a restaurant that said "The chef stated the maggot infested chicken was for personal use."  The restaurant was closed and I was buying some of their equipment....go figure.... 
 
 
The main points why I posted is-

• He was SELLING the sauces, which is illegal.  Any unlicensed person selling a homemade product is doing so illegally.  End of that conversation.
• As a warning to be careful of eating products from unlicensed people.  I know of people who've gotten home made beef jerky that was rancid, and others have gotten some free sauce that when "PFFFFFFT" when opened. 
• If someone had gotten product from this guy, get rid of it. 

 
 
I've always supported the hobby sauce makers and will continue to do so.  That's a big reason why I posted Making Hot Sauce 101.  This is not a Professionals-vs-Hobbyist situation.  We've had this similar discussion in other threads.  Let's move on. 
 
 
 
 
PS- sm1nds2~ I believe Lucky Dog Hot Sauce has stated in several occasions that he did not sell any sauces until he was legit. 
 
 
edit for spelling-

 

[Lucky Dog Hot Sauce]

 
Pretty much said that in this sentence:
 

"I would say that buying from inspected/licensed kitchens is a little safer."
 
 
Manufacturers are getting busted daily for trying to cut corners. That's why people get e coli 90% of the time. Most recent I can think of is when burgerking got busted for putting diseased horse meat in their burger. About ten years or so ago Food Lion was busted for washing their spoiled meat with bleach to kill the bacteria then adding red dye to it to give it color again. I find your argument invalid. Also kitchens are not inspected daily. When I worked at a high end restaurant about 15 years ago the inspector came once a year.
 
 
I figured you use to be given the love you seem to show for your sauces. Don't forget where you came from. I never said professionals I said corporations/manufacturers. "Some people" can include hobby sauce makers..
 
 
 
I too feel bad for his customers but this happens at manufacturing facilities too. Remember the story a few years ago with the condom in the toothpaste? Why focus on the illegality of selling sauces as a hobby? You were once a hobby sauce maker selling illegal uncertified/inspected sauces as well right?
 
 
 
Again I said: "I would say that buying from inspected/licensed kitchens is a little safer."
And: "People are taking a risk when buying any product they didn't make themselves, licensed or not. There is a common denominator and that is humans."
 
I feel like you are twisting my words AGAIN and I don't like it. I feel like some of these post are trying to scare the consumer into only buying sauces from "professional" sauce makers. I mean it's not like some of you have anything to gain by downing the avg joe hobby sauce maker or anything. Right? Sounds like politics in The Hot Pepper forums

I quoted you so no, I did not twist your words for an instant. No one is trying to scare hobbyists, but it certainly illustrates the risks of purchasing sauce that is not made or sold legally. To argue that is asinine.

In fact I responded directly to your points, and called BS on at least one of them. Sorry if you don't like that. Try being less antagonistic and make fewer generalizations when you post if you don't want people to respond & correct the obvious errors in your post.

You seem to have a chip on your shoulder about professional saucemakers and were (and are) attempting To foster an "us vs them" mentality where in fact none exists.

I remain a member of an underground hobbyist group on FB and still consider myself a hobby hot sauce maker - because I continue to make hobby hot sauce every other weekend for myself & friends & family. I just don't sell it. And your assertion there is also false: I did not sell my hobby sauce. For 1-2 batches I had people pay shipping and I solicited feedback - and even that was admittedly risky, but the people purchasing it had full disclosure & knew that it was made in my home kitchen.

In case you missed it I've been one of the people here at THP who helps others with food safety questions & am active in the business forums helping hobbyists go pro. If you payed a little more attention you'd probably have put it together that such behavior is the exact opposite of trying to intimidate hobbyists. More like supporting & encouraging them.

Try to pay attention. Might help prevent you from saying so many erroneous things on forums like this.

 
I've always supported the hobby sauce makers and will continue to do so.  That's a big reason why I posted Making Hot Sauce 101.  This is not a Professions-vs-Hobbyist situation.  We've had this similar discussion in other threads.  Let's move on. 
 

Some folks have an agenda of attempting to create divide Ann. They will never move on, just keep repeating the same BS despite evidence to te contrary.

Offer advice against selling a food product without liability insurance? Ha - you're just "afraid of competition"

Offer suggestions that their product should be certified / inspected and that there are real risks to selling an illegal food product? You're just "trying to intimidate hobbyists"

Try to help someone not get sued by suggesting that it's required for them to have a licensed food business or protect themselves with liability insurance? You're just "lobbying for the government who's overarching authority is keeping the man down"

We've heard it again and again - it won't stop, ever. Once I went pro I obviously changed my entire philosophy, became a sell-out lackey for the government and immediately turned my back on the hobbyists I called friends.

I'll never stop being amazed by the paranoia that permeates some segments of society.

 

[Weed]

No, the 2-4 times a year (or more depending on what product is being made) inspection means there are no rats in the facility to begin with.

 
Maybe YOUR state... but we've been down that road before right?

 
I'll never stop being amazed by the paranoia that permeates some segments of society.

 
He's going to take over the whole site!!!!! type of paranoia?
 
Anyway Ann, thanks for the warning about that particular seller.
 
I'm out of this thread.

 

[Penny]

Thanks for sharing. I would not want to ingest anything from that persons hands. 

 
 
Well said!!