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indoor Insect pollinators for indoor gardens

So I started a new indoor grow, I have several different types of superhots and hot peppers. They never seem to produce an abundance of fruit, and I know my growing conditions are spot on this time as the plants themselves are growing vigorously. The same plants, in the same soil, in the same container produce vigorously outside. Inside ... not so much. I have them under a 600w HPS digi ..

Its gotta be the pollination factor. However, I really would like to get around having to hand pollinate. Ive heard of people releasing ladybugs into indoor gardens when they bring plants in from outside to control aphids. Im curious, is there another type of insect that would live for a suitable period of time within a larger indoor garden? Say 8-15 plants or so .... that would pollinate the plants on their own?

I realize theres predatory insects that can be obtained ... but without the pests for them to feed on they really arent going to do well I wouldnt think. Maybe Butterflies? Moths?

... of course caterpillars destroy foilage ... so thats probably out.

Im just brainstorming here but anyone have any ideas??
 
if your plants are producing viable pollen then simply blowing a fan on them should do the trick...
 
Ill have to look into that more closely... You know, I have them in a 4x4 tent but Im about ready to ditch the tent all together and do it in open air in the room. This way I can set up a larger oscillating fan to make things happen. Inside the tent theres not a whole lot of room for a fan to oscillate back and forth and I think your right about that being whats needed.

On that note, out in open air I could get several fans from different directions and set them on a timer to come on for a few hours a day or even a couple times a day.

The grow tents are great in a lot of ways ... but lately Im thinking simply hanging the light from tent the frame, getting rid of the tent itself, and setting up fans may be the way to go. The lumens will drop a bit due to the larger area but I can probably make up for that in a different way by putting lower light requirement herbs and lettuces, basil, etc, etc out on the edges.

Hmmmm .... Ive got a 10x12 room I can use exclusively for this. I have a 600w digi HPS/MH, a 400w magnetic HPS, 2 - 4' 4 bulb T5's, and a single 4' 2 bulb shop light.

**Scratches head*** how do I want to do this??
 
you can take an electric tooth brush and hold the shaft to the stem for about 10 to 15 seconds

from what i have read it works

thanks your friend Joe
 
Ild rather not hand pollinate... in any way, shape, or form whether it be the tooth brush trick, paint brush, q-tip or shaking branches.

Then again, ild rather not have to work for a living so maybe that's just what I'm stuck with lol.

If fans are sufficient, I'm seriously considering putting the ten in storage and just growing straight in the room the tent is in. Anyone had good luck growing peppers indoors without hand pollination?
 
Insects simply will not work in such a set up, at least not as pollinators. A fan is probably your best option for more than one reason (for pollination, and air movement in general is good for plant health)
 
you can take an electric tooth brush and hold the shaft to the stem for about 10 to 15 seconds

from what i have read it works

thanks your friend Joe

^this

i visited a commercial greenhouse tomato grower and this is how they pollinated. im going to find one cheap this year to ensure i get better fruit set.
 
if you are having problems with pod set, there is something else wrong with the environment the plant is in...peppers are open pollinated and therefore wind should do the trick...however, when I see the flowers are producing pollen, I just grab the stalk and shake it vigorously several times...that is even better than the toothbrush...plus the vigorous shaking gets most of the stuff ready to fall off the plant too...but even when the flowers are producing pollen, it may sterile and therefore no pod set will occur...

I notice this in the extremes of summer...flowers produce a ton of pollen (when I get flowers) but get no pod set...
 
Hey OZZZ, No problem here with flower set indoors. I use a high output fan plus an oscillating fan. I credit the use of the fans for the chili's that will be growing soon. Flowers release pollen at certain times of the day, A high velocity fan will insure movement of the branches. (at all times) Plus less chance of developing mold or fungal bacteria with the air circulation As for the tent, I'd sell it. It seems like you'll have more than adequate space with fresh air to boot. Tents do "conceal" light and crop, but they have their limitations... Greg
 
I also agree with the fan or shaking the plant manually. Even without fan or shaking my indoor and greenhouse plants never have problems fruiting. I think you're right about getting rid of the tent. I'm sure it restricts a lot of airflow
 
^this

i visited a commercial greenhouse tomato grower and this is how they pollinated. im going to find one cheap this year to ensure i get better fruit set.

thanks souf i personally dont have a problem with pod set, however from what i know this works!!
thanks your friend Joe
 
I really appreciate the input guys... Im definately going to ditch the tent then. Well, I probably wont ditch it. Instead Im going to use the frame only by itself so that way I can still hang the lights, fans and other equipment. Ill just simply put the outside shell of the tent away in storage and simply use the frames as supports. That way I dont have to drill into walls or ceilings, etc, etc. As mentioned my room is 10x10.... and as far as Im concerned can be exlusively used for an indoor garden. Im going to run the 600, the 400, and both 4' 4 bulb T5's in there and get a garden room rocking! I already have 5 super hots (chocolate bhut, yellow bhut, butch T, fatalli, etc, etc) that are about 24" tall and flowering, but as mentioned they arent setting fruit Im sure with no fan in there thats a huge reason. Coming up I have some sweet neopolian peppers, determinant tomatoes, Basil, lemon balm, and a bunch of other suff as well. Im thinking I might simply buy those 4x4 hydro pans to place on the floor, and put the pots in those ... that way I dont have to worry about run off, dirt, or anything else getting to the carpet. Anyone have any ideas on something similar I can use as a pan that isnt as pricey?? They want like $100-$150 a piece for those 4x4 pans.

Edit: check this out. These might work well for floor protection...although I wouldn't mind something even cheaper (I would need 5 or 6 of the largest ones 48"x27") ...also something with a but more lip might be good. I rarely water to runoff so a huge lip isn't really necessary but it would be nice. Cheaper would be nice too 6 of these would run $180 plus shipping. http://www.moorepet....elaire-pt48.htm


Hey OZZZ, No problem here with flower set indoors. I use a high output fan plus an oscillating fan. I credit the use of the fans for the chili's that will be growing soon. Flowers release pollen at certain times of the day, A high velocity fan will insure movement of the branches. (at all times) Plus less chance of developing mold or fungal bacteria with the air circulation As for the tent, I'd sell it. It seems like you'll have more than adequate space with fresh air to boot. Tents do "conceal" light and crop, but they have their limitations... Greg

What do you mean specifically when you say a "high output fan"?? Just like a square box fan or something?? I have a 6" - 424cfm vortex blower but I use that to exhaust the lights and the room (out a nearby window).
 
take a look at concrete mixing tubs
at the homus depots
http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1v/R-202086173/h_d2/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053
or lowe's
i think they are like $5
or try 'bus trays' at restaurant depot
shape and function more important than looks
 
Thanks for the input. I need a tray preferably that is 4' in length. I dont mind smaller variations like the ones above that are 4'x2' as I can just get more of them. Those mixing tubs I could barely get one pot in. Ive seen some washing machine floor pans that are like 2' x 32" and I might be able to make that work but they are more expensive too.

I was thinking more along the lines of a larger floor covering type tray. Honestly those dog matts above would work well, since they are 4'x2' but its more the price then anything. As mentioned Ild need 6 of them and that would run about $180. I could arrange them any way I need though and that would work well. Even a large 5'x10' rubber mat of some kind might work well as long as it had a little bit of a lip to it.

I appreciate the suggestion the large mixing tubs they have almost would work .. but Ild still need one for every two pots.
 
So, I am not a grower of peppers beyond the three potted plants on my porch. But I AM a breeder of insects.

To grow my insects I grow a greenhouse full of plants of different species. If I get a heavy load of pests, such as thrips and flies, my plants, which are not self pollinators, produce healthy seeds.

However, keeping a thriving population of pests can, well, suck.

So. What about intentionally stocking pollinating insects?? The Australians do it with their native sting-less bees and have good results. You can also use flies, which are super cheap and easy and my first choice for the beginner!! They are sold by scientific supply companies, preying mantis breeders, etc etc. Wards scientific or Carolina biological supply are good go-tos. Flies can be bought as a plastic cup of pupae, and as long as you don't have rotting stuff for them to lay eggs in, they'll die out in a couple weeks. Flies will need a dish with sugar water and paper towel (so they can't drown in it) to get the maximum out of them so they don't die while they figure out how to feed from flower nectar. You can buy all kinds of flies, too, depending on how small they need to be to get into a flower.

Moths can be small and cheap, but since they are night active there's a good chance your daytime flowers will not be at their peak when the moths are let out.

I primarily breed butterflies. If only for the sheer fun of it, buying a few hundred butterfly eggs is inexpensive and for the week or two of their adult life you get a wonderful show in your greenhouse. (Captive bred butterflies tend to be short lived species such as cabbage whites and painted ladies, The max ever for a painted lady in my care was 4 months, typically 1.5 weeks, but if well cared for about half will make it to 2 weeks and then a third to three.) The temperature determines how fast they grow. So if you grow some in your green house and some at room temp in your house, and some in your cool basement man-cave, you'll have a steady stream of butterflies for three weeks from one batch of eggs. Give them light from a lamp most of the day (14Hrs a day is good) to prevent them from trying to think it's winter, there's no sun. and they should go to sleep (diapause) for a few months, Painted ladys don't diapause but many other species do.

What you do is buy a vial of cabbage white eggs, or a strip depending on how they sell them. Don't buy from a breeder who sells 15 eggs for a dollar each -- a single butterfly can produce a hundred eggs, they are ripping you off. Then, buy a bag of Stonefly diet from Ward's scientific supply company. When you get the bag, pour some into jar and stick the rest in the freezer so it doesn't go bad.

So your butterflies turn out normal, steal some broccoli leaves from the broccoli heads at the supermarket. Rub them with your fingers under flowing water to get rid of surface pesticides. Put them in a jar of cold water and store them in the fridge. Make up the diet from the jar with water and vinegar like it says on the bag. Press a ball of the diet the size of a shooter marble on the side of a plastic cup with a plastic lid, like solo brand cups and let it dry out for a couple hours before putting the lid on. You can also rubber band a piece of tissue paper over the cup. The diet may dry out and need replacing, but it will never get moldy that way. You can use fast food cups that you rinse out, like tiny yogurt parfaits from subway. For each parfait cup place 8-15 eggs, (So 10 cups for a hundred butterflies. Expect some escapees and non-hatches.) Let the eggs hatch and the caterpillars will climb up toward light. Let them eat the diet and grow a bit. They will shed their skins and poof up in size every few days. Once they've shed, give them pieces of broccoli leaf from your stash, on the bottom of the cup AWAY from the diet. The leaf pieces are small so they dry out to hay instead of getting moldy. The caterpillars need the dark green leaves for normal vision and better growth. When the diet on the side of the cup turns brown or cracks from drying out, shake out the caterpillars onto a plate, rinse the cup, and add new diet that's been give a couple hour to dry on the counter before adding.

It's about an hour of work every three days. The butterflies will turn into pupae in the cup. Then, pull off the lid and they'll fly out when they are ready.

Peppers are in Solanaceae, so the tobacco and tomato moths will try to lay eggs on them and probably you will get a caterpillar infestation. These moths are HUGE, widely available through scientific supply companies, and a HOOT to watch because they feed while flying at night, then visit you and have giant three inch tongues for probing flowers or in your ear. But, they are slow to grow and will have difficulty thriving on flowers that don't have pockets of nectar at then end of long tubes. However, since they're large, growing say, 10 tobacco horn worm moths will get you a lot of pollinator activity as their tongues explore every flower. You can buy them as food for frogs and other exotic pets, or from scientific supply companies These guys can go from a month lifecycle to five months if they don't get enough daylight. A short daylight cycle makes them stay as diapaused as a pupae for a long time.

ANYWAY. I have been using bugs for all kinds of stuff and it can be as easy as buying a pupae cup and letting the adults loose until they die a couple weeks later, or as complex as rearing insects for multiple months (large mantises take a LONG time to get to full size!)
 
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