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fermenting Other way to ferment, good or bad?

F

Fatalalanus

Hey! I have an idea on a way to ferment peppers. I guess that idea comes from my beer brewer background. So here it is:

-puree the peppers with other fruits or vegetable and sugar.
-pasteurize the puree on the stove
-adjust the consistency with water if needed
-put in a closed container with an airlock and a pure culture of lactobacillus (which I have on hand)

Since the puree is pasteurized and sealed in a fermenter, and since my lactobacillus strain produces co2, salt is not needed, unless there's another reason to use salt?
 
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Fatalalanus said:
Hey! I have an idea on a way to ferment peppers. I guess that idea comes from my beer brewer background. So here it is:

-puree the peppers with other fruits or vegetable and sugar.
-pasteurize the puree on the stove
-adjust the consistency with water if needed
-put in a closed container with an airlock and a pure culture of lactobacillus (which I have on hand)

Since the puree is pasteurized and sealed in a fermenter, and since my lactobacillus strain produces co2, salt is not needed, unless there's another reason to use salt?
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It might work.  I would make sure your pitching rate was really high on your lactobacillus, so as to prevent mold from getting its foot in the door, so to speak.  The salt is the biggest preventer of mold in a traditional ferment. 
 
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That was my intuiton.. Pasteurized puree in all clean-sanitized jars, I would not need to add salt. Only more sugar sources to gry more lactic acid.

What about a yeast strain like brettanonyces that produces acetic acid in aerobic environnement?
 
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I don't think there would be enough sugars in there to support a yeast strain. There have been several others who have talked of trying it but have never seen a posting of any success. 
 
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I think a Brett culture would bring alot of unwanted flavors (for me at least, dont forget the barn yard and horse blanket we get from it). Yes you would need some good sugar sources to make the lacto happy. Try it out and post it up!!!
 
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Ok, had time to think about the use of a brewing yeast to ferment a pepper mash as opposed to lacto. I don't think it will work, here's why. Oh and yes I'm a home brewer also, nothing better than a good home brew  :cheers:
 
So, when we pitch the yeast to our wort or must, if your a wine maker, we're pitching it to a readily available sugar source. We've already converted everything to sugars through the mashing process and the yeast can go right to work on it. In a pepper mash though all the sugars are still internal to the veggies we included in out mash. As yeast are a Bacteria they are able to work to begin breaking down the pepper mash and draw the sugars out. Yeasts can't do this. Which would mean that if you didn't add a ton of table sugar or other sugar source to the mash there wouldn't be anything for the yeast to work on. I also think that with that much raw sugar in there and the fact that we ferment pepper mashes at higher temperatures, typically 85 to 95 dF, it would cause a lot of Fussel Alcohols to be developed as well as off flavors from the yeast working at turbo speeds. I have a friend who is a professional brew master as well as a member of this forum and I can ask him to step in and give his opinion on the idea if you'd be interested.
 
have a great day!
 
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Thanks for the reply. Here's my view on this:

-when it's puréed and cookes a bit, sugars are available.
-brettanomyces work clean at 80-85%, i can tell you. No fusel at all. But still.. We could just ferment at the yeast optimal temp. If you ferment at 85-95, it's just because it's the sweet spot of lacto.

I would not use saccharomyces for the reasons you mentionned, and because the pH drop would not be enough I think, but brett/Dekkera is another story.
 
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If I may Id like to side with Fatalalanus. Lets not confuse the lactic bacteria (which we are talking about inoculating with and is the same bacteria that would get to work in traditional pickled...things...)  with a beer yeast. They are very different and work in different environments on different sources of food.
 
There is available fructose in the veggies we would typically put in the pepper mash including the peppers.
 
Ive not done it but ive worked with these critters a lot we can say and id say go for it!
 
And Fatalalanus  I have a mix of lacto and i think 5 different bretts i might be able to send your way. 
 
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Hey prime time that's very generous! Thanks but I already have some strains of lacto and brett since i'm really digging into sour/wild beer.

I will sure give the brett (brettanomyces bruxellensis) a try in a small sample, and give my no-salt technic a try too. And i'll let you know the results.

Ps: brett needs oxygen to produce acetic acid, unless it ferment just clean ethanol. Should I use a loose cap ou just a foil for this one instead of an airlock?

Edit: after thinking... What are the brett strains in your mix? It could be great for a Berliner weisse!
 
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Humm, ok, having not heard or Brett before, just read up a bit on it, interesting, could be possible. Would you want to go with just the Brett or use a combination of Bret and lacto? Could be interesting to try various combinations along with pure Brett.
 
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RocketMan said:
Humm, ok, having not heard or Brett before, just read up a bit on it, interesting, could be possible. Would you want to go with just the Brett or use a combination of Bret and lacto? Could be interesting to try various combinations along with pure Brett.
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Yhea I might try both, brett alone and brett with lacto, and even one of my lambic cake if I have a transfer to do at the same time (sacch, different bretts, lacto, peddio).

The brett strain I have produces a lot of mango/pineapple/peach flavors in 100%brett fermentation.. If i can get these flavor in sauces it would be amazing.
 
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I say loose cap but Rocket is the expert here. Airlocks are over rated.
 
The crazy blend i have is:
 
-Lactobacillus
Brett lambiscus
Brett bruxellensis
brett clausenii
brett fonteinen
 
Might be a bit much for a berliner
 
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Well, as it needs air there are 2 things i can think of. First would be to put a hole in the lid and run an air line to a air stone in sealing the hole around the tube. The other would be to use like a double fold of a thick towel so that only air was crossing, hopefully :) The best way would be the air stone I think so that it pushed out the Co2 and maintains a positive air pressure to keep the nasties out. 
 
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