fermenting Signs of a safe vs dangerous ferment

[worlok]

Hello all. Way back in March, I think MArch 11, 2013... I blended some red bell peppers and onions and mixed with yogurt whey. IT bubbled and fizzed nicely for awhile. I added in some hot peppers like habs, just cut up a bit - everything below the brine line. It stopped making a lot of gas a few weeks to a month ago, but if I leave it awhile it still does build up enough to show that there is CO2 being made, although at a much slower rate. The color is a great bright orange and it smells fine. No mold or scum. Some of the pepper remains on the outer screw lid outside the jar turned black but inside the jar all is fine and there are no bad smells. Just peppers and onions scent.

I guess I'm worried. How *do* you know that there isn't any botulism in there without tasting and risking your life? I've made dairy ferments like yogurt and kefir for a long time but those ferment fast. I never did this with vegetables before.

Thanks.

 

[Philip]

From http://www.fsis.usda.gov/factsheets/Clostridium_botulinum/index.asp

How is the Toxin Produced in Food?
C. botulinum spores are often found on the surfaces of fruits and vegetables and in seafood. The organism grows best under low-oxygen conditions and produces spores and toxins. The toxin is most commonly formed when food is improperly processed (canned) at home. C. botulinum cannot grow below a pH of 4.6, so acidic foods, such as most fruits, tomatoes, and pickles, can be safely processed in a water bath canner. However, foods with a higher pH (most vegetables and meats) must be processed under pressure. Therefore, a pressure cooker should be used. The pressure cooker will reach high enough temperatures to destroy the C. botulinum spores.

tl;dr botulism bacteria can't survive in that environment

They should know what they are talking about!
The mash should be way below a level of 4.6 pH after this long.

Happy eating!

/Philip

 

[worlok]

I gotta get a ph tester. Something I never picked up. Anyone know of any popular chain stores that carry them in store? Does Walmart carry stuff like that in store?

 

[Philip]

Yeah, that's a pretty good thing to have check milwaukee instruments on ebay, if i recall correctly. You won't need anything more precise than that for home use

Bell peppers, onions, and chiles have lots of sugars in them, so if the bubbling has slowed down/stopped, it should be at about 1.6% lactic acid (everything above 0,75% is considered good). The process slows down for two natural reasons. Either there is no more sugars for the bacteria to convert to bubbles and acid, or the environment is so acidic that the bacteria starts dying off. It's highly unlikely that you are out of sugars in the mash with those ingredients, so it should be safe.

/Philip

 

[worlok]

Thanks Philip.

 

[worlok]

I still have the ferment going. It's still making some gas as felt by pushing in the jar lid. I still haven't gotten a ph meter. Still think it's good? Here's a pic I just took.