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Newby first batch

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Yaakpepper

Hello Folks,

I have read a lot on here and elsewhere. I have my first 1/2 gallon batch started. I used dried De Arbol with some shredded carrot, garlic, and onion. I did add a few dried Ghost peppers as well. I made up the brine and added a little 1/4 cup kimchi juice. It seems to be fermenting well. It's been going about a week. My question is.... What's next? I want to do an extended ferment. 3 month or so. Should I grind the peppers at some point then rebottle to let ferment or just put a ferment lid on and let it go?

Thanks!
 
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Genetikx said:
I prefer to focus on botulism, thinking that covers everything else that could be of concern.

Here's a great handout that should be saved

https://www.nwedible.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/botulism3.pdf
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Ok, so based on this handout, it is impossible for me to get the temperature of the sauce high enough to kill botulism without special equipment which I don't have, therefore boiling is essentially irrelevant and as far as botulism is concerned, preventing its growth by ensuring the acidity is 4.6 or lower on the ph scale is what I need to be worried about.
 
So, is there any other reason I would boil the sauce?
 
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The way I'm reading the pdf is that an acidic environment prevents botulism spores from being created. IF your product has botulism spores, you need to bring it temp as described in the handout to kill the spores. What we worry about, is the botulism toxin that is formed from the spores. These nasties can be killed at 185 Fahrenheit.

I'm no expert in this, just try my best to follow the rules of the road so will let others weigh in if there's a better interpretation :)
 
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Genetikx said:
The way I'm reading the pdf is that an acidic environment prevents botulism spores from being created. IF your product has botulism spores, you need to bring it temp as described in the handout to kill the spores. What we worry about, is the botulism toxin that is formed from the spores. These nasties can be killed at 185 Fahrenheit.

I'm no expert in this, just try my best to follow the rules of the road so will let others weigh in if there's a better interpretation :)
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Hmm, I'm reading it as pre-existing spores can safely reside in an acidic environment, and so long as it remains below 4.6 on the PH scale, these spores will remain dormant and not make the deadly toxin.  And it says you have to get the temperature to at least 240f to kill the spores, which is well past boiling point and not possible with general home kitchen equipment.  So as far as I can see, from this pdf, the thing to worry about with regards to botulism is acidity rather than any heat treatment.  Yet from what I've read here, everyone seems to boil their sauce.  I guess there might be other things beside botulism that this will do for.  But certainly interested to hear from someone who knows a bit more about this.  In the meantime I've got my next ferment off to a start and it's got a lot more liquid in it than the last one, so I should be able to give it a hard boil plus simmer for a while without losing all the liquid.
 
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SmokenFire said:
 
 
To keep the tang AND have a thinner sauce water is your answer.  Dilution of acidity is real though, so for safety you should invest in a pH meter.  
 
You can also add brine to the fermentation vessel to increase liquids.  Here's a quick salinity guide I found:
 
4012185_orig.jpg


 
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Aww crap, I made my brines with 15g / 2 cups (3%). Am I in trouble?
 
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Coup said:
 
Aww crap, I made my brines with 15g / 2 cups (3%). Am I in trouble?
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Hard to say as I know nothing about what went into your ferment.  Provided everything was properly sanitized and airlocked chances are good you'll be fine, just let your eyes/nose be your guide.  
 
@ Aaron:
 
Many cook their ferments for various reasons, chiefly being that you want to stop fermentation (IF you are bottling in woozys) otherwise fermentation will continue in the bottles and eventually they will blow up.  For me the cookdown phase stops fermentation and allows me to adjust to desired thickness, and it keeps the sauce hot for hot fill/hold during bottling. 
 
Hope that helps.  :) 
 
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SmokenFire said:
 
Hard to say as I know nothing about what went into your ferment.  Provided everything was properly sanitized and airlocked chances are good you'll be fine, just let your eyes/nose be your guide.  
 
@ Aaron:
 
Many cook their ferments for various reasons, chiefly being that you want to stop fermentation (IF you are bottling in woozys) otherwise fermentation will continue in the bottles and eventually they will blow up.  For me the cookdown phase stops fermentation and allows me to adjust to desired thickness, and it keeps the sauce hot for hot fill/hold during bottling. 
 
Hope that helps.  :)
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Yup that helps a lot!  So I could for instance just give it a quick but hard boil to stop fermentation, then simmer very gently long enough to get desired thickness and bottle.  Think I more or less have gotten an understanding of the process now, but will probably find many more questions to ask.  Thanks to all who have answered them so far!
 
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Wow, lots of bot info! Thanks! Well Im getting ready to process.... has anybody used a juicer to remove all the juice from the pulp? Since I used dried peppers I did not cut the stems off. My thoughts.... pour juice off and save. Run peppers through juicer discard pulp, add initial juice back and cook to consistency? Add vinegar, done?
 
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It's all personal preference, but I think a lot of people like the flavor and body the pulverized pulp gives to the sauce. Might be a little messy, but I personally would sort through the solids and remove the stems and then blend everything together.
 
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Yaakpepper said:
Wow, lots of bot info! Thanks! Well Im getting ready to process.... has anybody used a juicer to remove all the juice from the pulp? Since I used dried peppers I did not cut the stems off. My thoughts.... pour juice off and save. Run peppers through juicer discard pulp, add initial juice back and cook to consistency? Add vinegar, done?
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Food mill.  I have this one and love it, even thought it's $10 more than when I bought it.  There are plenty out there though, and it will separate out the skins and seeds while still pushing through the pulp to give your sauce body and texture. 
 
A juicer could work, but I wonder if the dried peppers will clog the strainer.  
 
Can also just pour it off through a fine mesh strainer and use an orifice reducer on the top of the bottle - plenty of sauces are great that way too.  :)
 
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Yaakpepper said:
Now I guess I cook it down a little to thicken? How much vinegar and do I add before or after cooking?

Thanks!
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If you're going to keep it at room temperature you need enough vinegar or other acid to get the ph below 4. If it's staying in the fridge you don't need to add it, or just add it to taste.
 
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