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Pinched / Topped Plants vs UnImpeded Growing Plants
- Thread starter NorthernJeff
- Start date
I did a small test last year, NECM 2018 Topped & Not Topped Glog. A brief synopsis to this comparison is:
Plants did not display the same growth patterns as OP.
By late July plants were the same height.
Slight difference in bushiness between them.
No real difference in fruit production.
As always, YMMV.
Plants did not display the same growth patterns as OP.
By late July plants were the same height.
Slight difference in bushiness between them.
No real difference in fruit production.
As always, YMMV.
I always assume that when people "top" their plants, that it's an ongoing process. Because like you say, by mid-season, it has worked itself out. The natural inclination of any plant, is to grow towards the light.
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I trim the lower leaves and branches, and I always get a tree like appearance, and the plant sets fruit similar to the way the OP's plant did, but at an elevated level. I got a 7 pot Burgundy posted somewhere on this forum, and it wasn't growing very well, but it had more pods than leaves. (and I did it without bloom boosters, as a bonus - LOL)
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I trim the lower leaves and branches, and I always get a tree like appearance, and the plant sets fruit similar to the way the OP's plant did, but at an elevated level. I got a 7 pot Burgundy posted somewhere on this forum, and it wasn't growing very well, but it had more pods than leaves. (and I did it without bloom boosters, as a bonus - LOL)
Missed that as top is singular, duh.
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Top the plant as many times as desired.
My bad!
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at this website, Topping Pepper PlantsNorthernJeff said:
Top the plant as many times as desired.
My bad!
CaneDog
Extreme Member
I find different varieties respond differently to topping. Some will grow laterally from only the topmost node(s) while others will tend to bush out from a greater number of nodes. The ones that grow from only the topmost node will typically need to be topped early and more than once to create an early "bushy" shape and will also tend toward longer internodal spaces making height control more challenging. Most varieties seem to arrive at a bushy shape eventually, especially when grown outside, but many will reach something nearer full height before they develop significant bushiness. I'm of the opinion most will also produce at or near their optimum pod-weight potential without topping. I'd definitely read studies on the effects of topping on fruit production - heck, I followed NECM's thread all season - but I suspect there are so many variables among plant variety, growing environment, and timing of topping(s) that it would take extensive research to account for them.
Generally, I top only indoor plants. I do it when I'm trying to keep more of the plant foliage in the more effective lighting zone of artificial lighting or to prevent the plant from getting too tall for my lighting setup. Outside, I'm not concerned with topping, but with removing the lower leaves and/or branches to "lift" the plant and avoid splash-up of water/fungus/bacteria, improve air circulation, and keep pods up off the ground - the "little trees" idea.
The varieties that tend to grow tall early without much lateral branching (even after topping) I tend to top the earliest, although generally I would favor topping early vs. later in almost any situation, especially if rapid pod production were a primary consideration. When you have to top multiple times, fruit pod production is likely to be deferred longer, though peppers ultimately seem to have an internal clock and will simply start producing at some point.
I have a few cardenasii plants inside right now and I top them quickly and repeatedly, because they want to grow long stems/branches that don't fit my indoor model. Eventually, the plants will be growing so many branches simultaneously that they haven't the energy to "grow for height" especially if pot size (root development) is reasonably constrained. Internodal length often becomes progressively shorter allowing subsequent topping to keep the plant progressively lower.
Another way to use topping is slow foliage growth indoors for space while facilitating root development. A plant started well in advance of the season can be grown to a reasonable size, then cut back significantly on the main stem. If the containers are stepped up, the roots will develop and you may end up with a plant with well-developed roots for transplant outdoors, but that still fits conveniently into limitations of an indoor grow. Those roots will be better prepared to quickly develop the multiple branches encouraged by topping and you may be in a better position sooner outside than otherwise. This wouldn't necessary mean the plant was further along from time of sprouting, but it might be a way to have more rapid development subsequent to moving it outside when indoor space is limited.
Just some thoughts to consider. There are many reasons to consider topping and different varieties respond differently. Generally though, I don't consider topping as a way to significantly increase production. I tend to think the best way is to start indoors at the right time, not too late or early, step pots up regularly so roots aren't constrained (not simply before root-bound, but well before root-bound), and getting the plant out with proper hardening off after the cold snaps that might stunt it. Good media, proper water, adequate feeding. IMO, there aren't many (any) quick-fix gimmicks that are going to result in significantly better production than doing a great job with the basics.
EDIT: Wow, that post became a book fast!
Generally, I top only indoor plants. I do it when I'm trying to keep more of the plant foliage in the more effective lighting zone of artificial lighting or to prevent the plant from getting too tall for my lighting setup. Outside, I'm not concerned with topping, but with removing the lower leaves and/or branches to "lift" the plant and avoid splash-up of water/fungus/bacteria, improve air circulation, and keep pods up off the ground - the "little trees" idea.
The varieties that tend to grow tall early without much lateral branching (even after topping) I tend to top the earliest, although generally I would favor topping early vs. later in almost any situation, especially if rapid pod production were a primary consideration. When you have to top multiple times, fruit pod production is likely to be deferred longer, though peppers ultimately seem to have an internal clock and will simply start producing at some point.
I have a few cardenasii plants inside right now and I top them quickly and repeatedly, because they want to grow long stems/branches that don't fit my indoor model. Eventually, the plants will be growing so many branches simultaneously that they haven't the energy to "grow for height" especially if pot size (root development) is reasonably constrained. Internodal length often becomes progressively shorter allowing subsequent topping to keep the plant progressively lower.
Another way to use topping is slow foliage growth indoors for space while facilitating root development. A plant started well in advance of the season can be grown to a reasonable size, then cut back significantly on the main stem. If the containers are stepped up, the roots will develop and you may end up with a plant with well-developed roots for transplant outdoors, but that still fits conveniently into limitations of an indoor grow. Those roots will be better prepared to quickly develop the multiple branches encouraged by topping and you may be in a better position sooner outside than otherwise. This wouldn't necessary mean the plant was further along from time of sprouting, but it might be a way to have more rapid development subsequent to moving it outside when indoor space is limited.
Just some thoughts to consider. There are many reasons to consider topping and different varieties respond differently. Generally though, I don't consider topping as a way to significantly increase production. I tend to think the best way is to start indoors at the right time, not too late or early, step pots up regularly so roots aren't constrained (not simply before root-bound, but well before root-bound), and getting the plant out with proper hardening off after the cold snaps that might stunt it. Good media, proper water, adequate feeding. IMO, there aren't many (any) quick-fix gimmicks that are going to result in significantly better production than doing a great job with the basics.
EDIT: Wow, that post became a book fast!
CaneDog said:
It's not just one man's opinion. It's the gospel that I preach. Nobody that reads this forum has any excuse for not being able to grow a pepper, until they start trying to do "more better-er". The gimmicks will get you, every time. Nature doesn't cycle nutrients, and it doesn't top plants. (we have the luxury of "fiddling" with these things)
On another note, but related... I've got a rocoto that I've decided to bonsai. I trimmed it back to a 10" stick, and gave it a nice rich nutrient bed. There will be lots and lots of pinching and topping of that one.
CaneDog said:
Oh, I'm not gonna grow it indoors. I can easily keep it going outdoors all year.
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But to answer your question, I have a Cuzco that was just sitting around. Maybe later, if it works, I'll try an Ecuadorian Sweet and and Arequipena (for the shock pod value). Minis would be awesome, too.
Wouldn't make much sense to "top" most rocotos as many varieties already start to fork after the second set of true leaves. Montufar forks before it's even out of it's first seedling pot. What would be cool, though, is to try doing an espalier. I am seriously considering that for next season.
Regarding wind, it's not the size of the plant that takes it down rather the resistance i.e. lack of sufficient airflow between the branches. I have Manzano Rojos, which are absolutely huge plants, and they are able to withstand wind so long as the pot isn't dry due to the way I spread the branches out and attach them to the in-pot stakes. Of course, if there is a storm then I move (drag) them to a slightly more sheltered location.
Regarding wind, it's not the size of the plant that takes it down rather the resistance i.e. lack of sufficient airflow between the branches. I have Manzano Rojos, which are absolutely huge plants, and they are able to withstand wind so long as the pot isn't dry due to the way I spread the branches out and attach them to the in-pot stakes. Of course, if there is a storm then I move (drag) them to a slightly more sheltered location.
I would be interested to know the harvest number in weight for each plant. Because at the end of the day, that is where it counts. I know you said 15-20 percent more fruits, but are they bigger, weigh more. I know most of us are growing for our own personal use so its not that big of a deal (depending on how much you need that bite in your life, lol.), but that is the real study that matters. Especially for mom and pop outdoor soil growers who have plenty of space and good top soil, where it doesnt matter how tall or wide they are and maybe peppers might get you through a tough fall every now and then! Also wanted to just say thanks for taking the time to do this for all of us! Happy growing!