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Relative growth/health.

S

svcook

Is a large variation in plant size normal? Within the same pepper type I see large size/health variance between plants. I have a row of 9 habanero plants and the range in size us from a couple of inches to a foot tall.

Same with my bhutes. Moat are pretty small but two that seem much "better".

I started all the plants at the same time and under the same conditions from day one.

I wish I could attribute it to poor soil but if that were the case then they would all be the same---so it would seem.
 
Phenotype(what the plant looks like) = Genotype(genetics) + Environment(the environment the plant is grown in). If the environment is consistent across all of your plants then the difference is mostly genetic. Some individuals are more robust than others, but this may not be directly correlated to the abundance of fruit (but usually this is the case).
 
Darkside said:
Phenotype(what the plant looks like) = Genotype(genetics) + Environment(the environment the plant is grown in). If the environment is consistent across all of your plants then the difference is mostly genetic. Some individuals are more robust than others, but this may not be directly correlated to the abundance of fruit (but usually this is the case).
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So this fall if I save seeds from the best plants then I would be perpetuating the stronger strain. And let the week ones die.
 
svcook said:
So this fall if I save seeds from the best plants then I would be perpetuating the stronger strain. And let the week ones die.
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maybe...but if the plants have been cross polinated from another variety, what you see in your largest, strongest plant is hybrid vigor...and you will only know if the seed grows true...
 
AlabamaJack said:
maybe...but if the plants have been cross polinated from another variety, what you see in your largest, strongest plant is hybrid vigor...and you will only know if the seed grows true...
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Is it common for a hybrid to demonstrate aggressive growth relative to it's non-hybrid parent?
 
svcook said:
So this fall if I save seeds from the best plants then I would be perpetuating the stronger strain. And let the week ones die.
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When selecting for a trait such as size and vigor of the plant you have to be mindful of other important traits such as the productivity of the plant along with the size, shape and taste of the pods.
 
Avon Barksdale said:
Yeah it's called hybrid vigor or heterosis http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heterosis
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I find heterosis/hybrid vigor to be a generally misunderstood process because many people neglect the impact of outbreeding depression on the resulting offspring. This is especially true of both plants and animals adapted to specific environmental conditions that receive dominant genes adapted to different conditions. For example Brahman cattle have been bred specifically to survive in tropical conditions, crossing this breed with a northern adapted cattle like a Hereford will result in an animal that may or may not provide more meat, but will definitely suffer in the heat as a result of dominant Hereford genes. I'm sure there are some examples of this pertaining to chilis but with chilis, at least on a small scale we can exert a lot more environmental control so out-crossing should have less of an impact.
 
I could be wrong on this, so anyone please correct me if I am, but that is one way to HELP determine if a plant/pod has been cross pollinated. Like your example, if you have 1 plant/pod that is very different than the other 10 or so plants...I would be suspicious of that plant being crossed. I am not implying that just because a plant/pod is different or bigger than the others means it was crossed, I am just saying it would get my attention that it is a possibility.
 
Darkside said:
I find heterosis/hybrid vigor to be a generally misunderstood process because many people neglect the impact of outbreeding depression on the resulting offspring. This is especially true of both plants and animals adapted to specific environmental conditions that receive dominant genes adapted to different conditions. For example Brahman cattle have been bred specifically to survive in tropical conditions, crossing this breed with a northern adapted cattle like a Hereford will result in an animal that may or may not provide more meat, but will definitely suffer in the heat as a result of dominant Hereford genes. I'm sure there are some examples of this pertaining to chilis but with chilis, at least on a small scale we can exert a lot more environmental control so out-crossing should have less of an impact.
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Of course it's not a guarantee that a hybrid will grow better and produce more than an OP plant, but there's a reason why 99 percent of corn, wheat, soybeans, cotton, peanuts, etc. are grown from hybrid seeds. It seems far more likely that an F1 will benefit from reduced inbreeding depression than it is that it will be negatively affected by outbreeding depression. Animals are a bit of a different story I think. E.g. some animals benefit from smaller size, so breeding with a larger breed could be disadvantageous. I can't think of any reason why a chile pepper wouldn't benefit from larger size. The F1 chile peppers I've grown generally seemed to be faster growers, bigger producers, and more disease resistant than OP varieties.
 
Avon Barksdale said:
Of course it's not a guarantee that a hybrid will grow better and produce more than an OP plant, but there's a reason why 99 percent of corn, wheat, soybeans, cotton, peanuts, etc. are grown from hybrid seeds. It seems far more likely that an F1 will benefit from reduced inbreeding depression than it is that it will be negatively affected by outbreeding depression. Animals are a bit of a different story I think. E.g. some animals benefit from smaller size, so breeding with a larger breed could be disadvantageous. I can't think of any reason why a chile pepper wouldn't benefit from larger size. The F1 chile peppers I've grown generally seemed to be faster growers, bigger producers, and more disease resistant than OP varieties.
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Bhuts for example are fairly large, but low yield pepper plants where as some habs are small and quite bushy but have relatively high yields of fruit. The problem with selecting for productivity is that productivity isn't necessarily correlated to taste... a good example of this are many of the store bought tomatoes which look large, red and delicious, but taste like coloured water.
 
Darkside said:
Bhuts for example are fairly large, but low yield pepper plants where as some habs are small and quite bushy but have relatively high yields of fruit. The problem with selecting for productivity is that productivity isn't necessarily correlated to taste... a good example of this are many of the store bought tomatoes which look large, red and delicious, but taste like coloured water.
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Yeah I agree with you there.
 
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