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This is going to be my new baby (gun)

I think the best thing to do is ask the opinion of a gunsmith. Back when that's what I did for a living(mid-late 70's eighties) S&W became junk. Whether they tightened their act up to compete with the more recent Walther, Glock, Sigs,Taurus, Berettas, I don't know.I would hope so.

They started making fine firearms in the 80's. My S&W 4506 is real nice.

and my first gun sadly :( Better late then never! I'm not stopping at this either! haha.
Give me your opinions and tell me what you think!
http://www.smith-wes...playErrorView_Y

Good caliber choice! The .45 ACP and the .40 S&W are the only two defence rounds I would have.
The 9mm is a chin gun in my opinion and shooting a perp with one will just piss him off. :lol:
 
They started making fine firearms in the 80's. My S&W 4506 is real nice.



Good caliber choice! The .45 ACP and the .40 S&W are the only two defence rounds I would have.
The 9mm is a chin gun in my opinion and shooting a perp with one will just piss him off. :lol:

.357 will go through the perp, the guy behind him, the guy behind him, the wall behind him, the car behind the wall.....lol
 
.357 will go through the perp, the guy behind him, the guy behind him, the wall behind him, the car behind the wall.....lol

I think you are talking about a Desert Eagle AKA hand cannon A .50 will stop a Mack Truck in its tracks! :stop: :shocked: Oh yeah same with the 500 magnum lol. But I wouldnt want to wake up the whole neighborhood! :party:

They started making fine firearms in the 80's. My S&W 4506 is real nice.



Good caliber choice! The .45 ACP and the .40 S&W are the only two defence rounds I would have.
The 9mm is a chin gun in my opinion and shooting a perp with one will just piss him off. :lol:
Thanks buddy I agree, God forbid I have to shoot some idiot, I dont want him getting back up again :)
 
I think you are talking about a Desert Eagle AKA hand cannon A .50 will stop a Mack Truck in its tracks! :stop: :shocked: Oh yeah same with the 500 magnum lol. But I wouldnt want to wake up the whole neighborhood! :party:

Thanks buddy I agree, God forbid I have to shoot some idiot, I dont want him getting back up again :)

I've shot a 45/70 derrenger....desert eagle has nothing on that...

For referece the 45/70 is #2 the .500 S&W is #6

mvc831xyr9.jpg
 
Personal defence, IMHO, is close up and personal.
No real need for anything that can take the wings off a fly @ 50 yards.
Or even 20.
Hand cannons are nice, but hard to justify if they go through your neighbors walls.
In some cases----many neighbors walls. :shh:

Law enforcement and *other uses* are a different matter.
 
Personal defence, IMHO, is close up and personal.

Yes, but I just don't feel as protected with a knife.
:rofl:

I agree though - it's why for home defense I leave .38 hydroshock hollow points in my A19.

Small entry wound, late exit would, no holes in my walls.

I hope to never need it but I do like the versatility of the .357 for that reason.

I disagree with the person who said 9 mm would just annoy the burgler. I have an alternate theory - it goes, "shot is shot". Unless the assailant is on PCP, a 9 or a .38 will do the job. I know there's a lot of joking in the gun community about small caliber weapons and burgler's reaction to them, but most are unrealistic. If someone gets shot it's a pretty darn traumatic experience. They are highly likely to turn tail & run seeing as how they have a hole in them and you're holding something capable of making another. Hell, a .22 round still makes a hole in a human where they don't want one and I think 98% of burgers would gtfo of they got shot with anything. No one likes getting shot regardless of caliber. It pretty much will ruin your whole night.

I feel pretty confident my .38 rounds are sufficient for home defense. Shot is shot.

Now, that said larger caliber = greater chance of fatality = less chance of getting sued by a criminal for shooting them. In CA that's a consideration. Unfortunately.
 
Anybody here ever seen a person shot with a 9mm......personally?

I would never carry less than a 40. And if you are going to carry prepare yourself to shoot somebody. If you are carrying a gun to pull it and scare away a felon, you may find yourself disarmed and shot with your own gun......seen it happen twice.

Never carry a gun unless you know you can, and will use it.

Best advice you will ever receive.
 
Anybody here ever seen a person shot with a 9mm......personally?

The police here years ago shot a perp on PCP 39 times with a 9mm before he went down.
If it had been a .45 ACP I doubt they would have had to use more than 6 rounds if that.
Of course it does depend on shot placement as well.

.357 will go through the perp, the guy behind him, the guy behind him, the wall behind him, the car behind the wall.....lol

They don't penetrate that much. Actually the .357 with a lighter hollowpoint is a good manstopper.
Only problem with revolvers though is that if it is discharged in a dark room the muzzle flash will temporarily ruin your night vision because of the gap in the cylinder walls that allows the flash. Not good to lose sight of your target. ;-)

A good book on the subject of home defense by the way is Massad Ayoob's, "In the Gravest Extreme."

I disagree with the person who said 9 mm would just annoy the burgler. I have an alternate theory - it goes, "shot is shot". Unless the assailant is on PCP, a 9 or a .38 will do the job. I know there's a lot of joking in the gun community about small caliber weapons and burgler's reaction to them, but most are unrealistic. If someone gets shot it's a pretty darn traumatic experience.

Scott, there is a reason police officers do not carry the 9mm any longer for the most part.
Yes it will and can stop a person if hit just right but any shots "around the edges" it does not have the hydrostatic shock necessary to create the tissue damage needed to stop the perpetrator from returning fire.
By the way, my brother-in-law is a veteran police officer for Hayward.
 
357, in revolver or auto, is one of the best ballistic handgun rounds in the world.

Secret Service and Air Marshall shoot 357.....no overpenetration.
 
357, in revolver or auto, is one of the best ballistic handgun rounds in the world.

Secret Service and Air Marshall shoot 357.....no overpenetration.

You would think they would opt for the .45 ACP for the same reasons.
It's big, heavy and slow. Of course it does produce more recoil because of the heavier projectile but it's still managable.
I used to shoot a Thompson/Center Super 14 Contender in .35 Rem with a max loaded 200 gr. round nose Sierra in it.
More muzzle energy at 100 yds than the .44 Mag has at the muzzle.
It was painful to shoot after a few rounds. ;)
 
45s are good for the first shot, followup shots not so much, too much recoil. In law enforcement you may be engaging more than one person, followup shots are imporant.
 
Scott, there is a reason police officers do not carry the 9mm any longer for the most part.
Yes it will and can stop a person if hit just right but any shots "around the edges" it does not have the hydrostatic shock necessary to create the tissue damage needed to stop the perpetrator from returning fire.
By the way, my brother-in-law is a veteran police officer for Hayward.

I believe that 39 shots dude was probably a rare exception. I get what you're saying, and I've read similar things - I guess my point was that for burglary / home defense just about any caliber is suficient as these are likely to be nonviolent offenders.

For the kinds of criminals cops deal with - gang bangers, people high on meth or worse, I think you're spot on - .40 cal, .45, .357 is necessary.

Hayward PD - rough gig. I'm in unincorporated Hayward so we get sheriffs & highway patrol. But there are some rough parts of this town. I wouldn't want to Be PD here. Last week at the farmer's
Mkt I tried to give some HPD foot patrol free hot sauce to support the cause & they said dept regs prevented them from accepting it. Bummer! They can be a little over zealous, at times but for the most part HPD's ok by me. :cheers:

Maybe I'm under-armed with the .38 hydroshocks (though i think they're rated pretty highly for stopping power) but I don't expect burglar to be the type to keep coming at me after they've been shot. I could be wrong...just seems like a different type of criminal in a burglary as compared to a home invasion.

I completely agree with Armac that if you carry you must be prepared to use it - I don't have a carry license (almost impossible to get in CA) and I'm not sure I'd get one if I could - just not much need for me. But Armac is correct - it takes more than a gun...it takes the will to apply deadly force, which one hopes is steadfast if such a circumstance arises. I can shoot at the range every week, but that doesn't prepare you for the reality of shooting a human being.

That said, I believe the best gun is one you never have to use against another person, so I pray to never have to shoot anyone. It would be a horrible experience.



45s are good for the first shot, followup shots not so much, too much recoil. In law enforcement you may be engaging more than one person, followup shots are imporant.

Interesting point - my buddy's 1911 in .45 doesn't jump much, but I do notice my shots creep upwards along the target and I have to re-aim every shot. I guess in a real-world application that makes a huge difference. I never thought of that before.

Sorry if you said it already, but what was your gun of choice when you were in LE? Glock .40 cal?

Ps - I love my S&W model 19. The 6" barrel is great as it balances it - not much recoil regardless of ammo. Probably not a practical carry gun - it's heavy, big & with 6 shots only. There's speed loaders, but that still takes time.

You would think they would opt for the .45 ACP for the same reasons.
It's big, heavy and slow. Of course it does produce more recoil because of the heavier projectile but it's still managable.
I used to shoot a Thompson/Center Super 14 Contender in .35 Rem with a max loaded 200 gr. round nose Sierra in it.
More muzzle energy at 100 yds than the .44 Mag has at the muzzle.
It was painful to shoot after a few rounds. ;)

Funny you mention that - my buddy (ex MP, FFL) has a Thompson contender and after 4 shots I handed it back to him as it was painful to shoot. He called me a puss, so glad to know I'm not the only one!
:rofl:
 
You can have the coolest gun, but if you cannot (no skills or practice) or will not (wrong mindset) pull the trigger AND hit your target. You are prey in a bad situation.

If you do find yourself in a tough situation and you handle it, some folks have difficulty with the fallout. What happens after a shooting can be as traumatic as the incident itself. Litigation is a bitch.

In the end, try to avoid bad situations, better all the way around.
 
Been shot at twice......not fun.

Just be careful, and pray.

I believe I have detoured this guys gun thread enough.

Buy the gun that is comfortable for you, practice, and learn about the legal issues in your state. Remember that guns are a tool to be used in dangerous situations.
 
Been shot at twice......not fun.

Just be careful, and pray.

I believe I have detoured this guys gun thread enough.

Buy the gun that is comfortable for you, practice, and learn about the legal issues in your state. Remember that guns are a tool to be used in dangerous situations.

Sage advice.
 
It's big, heavy and slow. Of course it does produce more recoil because of the heavier projectile but it's still managable.

what? The .357 (both sig and revolver rounds) are 1600+FPS even with the heavier bullets. 45acp at best is 1200, the rounds I use are 1100. My Kimber Ultra carry is lighter overall and more weight distribution over the top of the gun due to the lighter frame/heavier slide than my m&p and it still has no where near the recoil/lift of the .357. It was so bad out of the box I put recoil suppression.

See the videos: http://www.gunblast.com/DPM-SWMP.htm

MAYBE if you're firing the 357sig out of big heavy full size all metal gun but who carrys those? BTW Fish and game out here uses 357sig because it penetrates further through heavy clothing in the winter months.

As for muzzle flash that may be true about the revolver round but not so much with the sig round.
 
what? The .357 (both sig and revolver rounds) are 1600+FPS even with the heavier bullets. 45acp at best is 1200, the rounds I use are 1100.

Look at the bullet weights. The .45 ACP is shooting a 230 gr. bullet which is fairly heavy.
Recoil is based on several things but the weight of the firearm makes the biggest difference.
Also, different handguns have varying levels of muzzle flip depending on caliber, round, how the firearm sits in the hand, etc.
Quick follow-up shots with the .45 ACP is a little harder I think than other auto rounds. Not sure about the .40 as I have never fired one.
 
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