vendor Brain Strain Yellow and "Other" Pod Problems!!

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Ok....first let me start by saying to the mods and the admin...if i have posted this in the wrong place i am sorry and please help me out by placing this in the right place :)

I recently have been getting some flack and such from a few customers "claiming" im only sending ONE or TWO pods of the correct "Type" they have ordered in their boxes, along with some "other" type of pepper to fill the rest of the box! I guess i have to take my time and loose sleep over this to help you guys out with this.......EVERY, and i mean EEEEVVVEEERRRYYYYY plant on my property i inspect for "PICTURE PERFECT" pods before i tag and label it as a "correct match" to the type it is supposed to be! With that being said, i have harvested several of the same customers previous orders of the SAME EXACT plants and have had ZERO complaints. Why or how is this so you may ask?? Heres WHY and a little bit of "Pepper Growing 101" on a HUGE scale!!! Something i had to learn myself so i dont expect your "AVERAGE" hobby grower to even consider it possible! Right now...this very minute.....i have plants with PICTURE PERFECT (Lets say BS Yellow cus thats the pods in question from most right now) pods on them...and on the VERY SAME NODE on that plant i have another pepper (codename "odd one") that looks just like a yellow BS with some of the wrinkles missing and "tail" section not as "defined" as the picture perfect one growing on the SAME PLANT and ON THE SAME NODE section...SIDE BY SIDE on the SAME PLANT! This in NO way shape or form means that this "odd one" is not a BS Yellow!! I mean for pete sake they are growing on the SAME PLANT and their stems are almost touching at the same NODE! But one is PERFECTLY representing a BEAUTIFUL Brain Strain Yellow! So....heres the science lesson ladies and gents... Theres NO WAY that on a "genetic" level these two peppers are NOT the same!! They came off the same plant!! THAT is a proven scientific FACT! Now....i will agree if someone said the SEEDS inside MAY/MAY NOT grow a "true" genetic match, but that has ZERO impact on the type of pepper that the plant itself grows! PERIOD! There are different "factors" that go into "pod" appearance....first there is how long the "flower ring" holds on to the pepper and causes the shape to change...i.e....if you have 2 peppers growing side by side on the same plant, and one holds the "flower ring" a week longer than the other while the pod is forming..the one that held the "flower ring" longer will have a more defined and "true" pod shape and appearance! That i learned from growing THOUSANDS of plants to full maturity this year and watching them all form and shape on the plants DAILY! Second...there are insects that will in fact alter/change the course and growth of your plants/fruit as well....Broad Mites! These little buggers attack eat and destroy the "new" growth on pepper plants....i.e....the new as well well as the established flowers on the plants. When u have an insect outbreak and you are in the process of geting it under control they are causing the flowers to drop their "flower rings" early and some of the pods just dont have the PICTURE perfect pod shape as a result! So...................... in closing i would like to say to ALL of my customers...I have NOT and will NEVER sell you a product that is NOT 100% coming from the same plants that grow "PICTURE PERFECT PEPPERS!! The conditions here in the nursery alter/change the pod appearance as well as weather, heat, nutrients, watering (or lack of)...theres MULTIPLE things that can make a plant have some PERFECT looking pods and some that just dont...period! BUT NEVER THE LESS THAT DOES NOT MEAN THEY ARE NOT WHAT YOU ARE BUYING OR THINK YOU ARE BUYING!! IF A PEPPER PLANT GROWS ONE TYPE THIS WEEK, NEXT MONTH IT GROWS THE SAME THING!! IT NEVER CHANGES!!

Like i said before...i dont expect your "average joe" to be able to see that on his plants, or even understand all that i just said. Heck, even myself when i was just a hobby grower i had no idea this was even possible really....until i grew on this HUGE scale!! In fact..i have even eaten pods like i mentioned before (2 off the same plant that look not the same) and they both had the SAME heat, texture, seed levels present, flavor, and even the same afterburn/taste! Again...from the SAME plant how could they NOT??? Right?? Right!! Physically, they "appear" different, but in fact are the SAME!! I hope this has made some sense to ALL of you...i do realize that i cant please everyone EVERYTIME, but you guys need to understand that i WILL NEVER sell you something im not 100% sure came from plants that show PERFECT pods!! My whole 60 year family reputation is on the line here!! Take it from a hobby grower turned COMMERCIAL grower! This is something i am learning as i go...and again...i dont expect EVERYONE to really grasp it and register what im saying...

One last thing..and this will CLEAR this all up for you guys hopefully........RIGHT NOW...i mean as of right now...i have some of these VERY same plant producing Brain Strain Yellow plants that i harvested to fill these recent orders in question.... almost FILLED with picture perfect pods...new ones....still young...and the pods "appear" 100% genetic matches to a PERFECT BS Yellow! On the same plants where you guys "questionable" pods came from!! NOW........you tell me how thats possible if THE PLANTS are NOT Brain Strain Yellow!!!

Those of you that know me, know that im just a family guy, trying to earn an honest living growing these things..and some of you have also had "other" issues with pods or what have you..and i have ALWAYS made good to my customers when i know theres something "I" could have done or helped make sure the product was exactly what the customer ordered.....and i ALWAYS have made good on those....thats how we pride ourselves on good business ethics! I want you all to know I, Dale Jr, PERSONALLY have hand harvested EVERY pod shipped out of Baker's Peppers LLC up to date! EVERY ONE! and i dont pick pods from plants that have not PROVEN to me they are 100% geneticly a MATCH! if i did that, i would have issues like THIS on my hands!! And by the looks of it, that couldnt be helped, by no fault of ANYONE!! Myself, the plants, or the customers! I mean, who has EVER grown these on a scale like this?? How could anyone have known these factors that go into all of this...i sure didnt! But rest assured, if YOU order product from Baker's Peppers LLC, our products have come from plants that produce pods that ARE picture PERFECT...................Under the right PERFECT conditions in nature!! Trust me, Let your plants go without proper fertilizer or water or pest control while flowering/fruiting and SEE FOR YOURSELF the effects of it! Now in saying that i am partially admiting that thru the season myself or my father have not been able to 100% keep up with all of those (watering, ferts, pest/bacteria control). We are a 2 man show and have been BUSTING ASS trying to keep up with all this DEMAND! So we have experienced some ups and downs and along that road we have found out that this EFFECTS pod appearance!!! Theres NO other explanation for this issue! I as the grower of these things here on my property am 100% sure of this, as i have WITNESSED it ALL with my OWN eyes!! I would like to send out an apology to those who cant or wont agree with our findings. All i can say is im sorry you wont return to do business with us. I cant control how "sometimes" these pods dont "appear" perfect....but i give you my WORD as a man, father, and hard worker.......I WILL NEVER SELL YOU PEPPERS THAT IM NOT 100% POSITIVE CAME FROM PLANTS THAT HAVE GROWN "PERFECT" PODS UNDER "PERFECT" CONDITIONS....Sometimes they "APPEAR" perfect and sometimes they dont.....That will ALWAYS be a factor when these peppers are grown on a HUGE scale like we are doing.........PERIOD!! So if you buy from me, or from someone else who has grown on a scale bigger than a "backyard" grow, you will find that not all pods on the same plant, no matter how PURE the seeds, will all be 100% PERFECT! IT JUST ISNT REALITY!!

Now, some of you may say well they are open pollinated so that is why the pods dont "appear" 100% the same perfect! Tisk tisk! :) Any simple bit of research into how pollination works and how it effects things will tell you that when a plant flowers and gets pollinated the plant produces pods on a genetic level how its been programmed since IT was a seed....pollination has ZERO effect on this....ONLY the seeds INSIDE this pepper will have a change in genetics!! The plant will ALWAYS be a Butch T (or whatever type u have) but the open pollinated seeds inside its peppers is ANYONES guess!! The plant, for its WHOLE life will ALWAYS produce its type of peppers! It will never be changed by pollination of its flowers, but the seeds inside could be crossed with ANYTHING of its "breeding" type around!

I hope this has helped some of you know a bit more about all of this, as it has been a learning curve for me as well....And i hope you guys understand that all i ever wanted to do was get the masses the peppers they desire...period! and thats all we are GOING to keep doing! :D

P.S.- One last thing i wanted to add...here at the nursery, we have whats known as "The Pile". And almost DAILY i find plants out in the nursery that have NOT ONE of these "PERFECT 100% MATCHES" to what its supposed to be found on them! ALL and i mean EVERY one of these plants finds its way to "The Pile"!!! Regardless of how long i have grown it for and how much care and cost i have put into that plant! PERIOD! It goes to "The Pile" to die...PERIOD! We dont grow or sell ANYTHING we are not 100% sure of!!

Dale Baker Jr
Baker's Peppers LLC
www.BakersPeppers.com


Lastly...I would like to add that i purchased ALL my Brain Strain Yellow seeds from Cappy at www.BrainStrain7.com and ALL my Brain Strain Red seeds from Judy at www.PepperLover.com ... I hope that clears up some confusion and i formally appologize to Judy about the mix up on where my seeds came from! :D
 
I'M DONE HERE! u guys have nothing better to do than bash me...I have made it right by the customers..and they are ALL that's important here!! Now I have other vendors taking shots at me...I made an honest mistake on where the seeds came from....I said over and over I was sorry...and more bashing came!! This thread is dead to me...I have been nice...I have been mean...I have tried to be civil....and in the end I'm in the wrong no matter what...why?? Because I decided to conduct business on a FORUM! I have made right by my customers....u say Judy is a "class act"? Look hows she's conducted herself in this matter!! Done here!! My product speaks for itself!! U can like it or not...Bakers Peppers is here to STAY!! Am I just supposed to sit here while everything I have worked so hard to build is put in jeopardy?!?! Anyone would protect their name in my situation...period!

Dale, you tainted your name all by yourself. By conducting yourself the way you did with a paying customer. Next time you get a complaint, take a different stance and I guarantee you none of this will happen. PM or not, nothing is private in a forum. If a vendor spoke to me in that manner I would never do business with them again. My profession is procurement, I deal with sales people like you all the time. I never base my purchasing decisions on price alone, customer service is by far one of the most important things I look for in a vendor. You really did this to yourself, I could not believe some of the comments you made to Denniz. DON'T BLAME OTHERS FOR YOUR OWN ACTIONS. And I am sorry but when you are buying seeds, especially at the super hot seed prices, you DON'T forget where they came from. The statement you made about Judy's seed stock, whether is was a mistake or not, is pretty serious for a business owner.
 
Dale- your best options now:


1- Send him (upset customer) a new box with a refund too.( a little extra- chuck a box of cigars in there)
Ask anyone else on here if there satisfied by a pm.

2- Apologize to Judy and send her some Champagne or chocolates.

3- Look into yourself- ask, "I'm I too defensive, aggressive, right for this business?" Do I need a manager? Cos this produce is very risky indeed. You are always gonna have these issues.

4- Attention to detail like Judy has, is important.Break your methods down by time and task organisation. I think, you are not organised enough at the moment.It is a new business mate.
Do you have enough quality standards( minimum characteristics) around, Photos of the chillies as a quality standard for pickers??
You have to inspect and think would I be happy, if you doubt, don't send.

5- You are your competition, not her, you will only alienate her and others on here by taking her on like that.

I think you can recover- but you should let this fade and do your best to make amends in the meantime mate. The good thing is that I think the new pods are interesting , you should re-brand and market them as so, keep the seeds for next year!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
I have never bought from either Judy or Dale, but I have to say this:

Judy seems to me to be justifiably angry about things. Dale does not. Judy seems to want things set straight. Dale just wants to place fault elsewhere.

I have read the things you said towards the OP, and they were absolutely unacceptable. Rude, egotistical, fat headed. You charge a premium price, one expects a premium product. You did not deliver, and that's okay. Every once in a while, thats okay, as long as you immediately, unhesitatingly rectify the situation. You did not.

I am no expert on peppers or on customer service, but I know people, and evidently you don't Dale. This is a com,unity of hobby growers, and the first thing you do is put us down? How dare you?

You are a weasel, Dale, You give yourself a bad name, and you are a blight on the growing community. You say you are finished here? I say "Thank God."
 
I'M DONE HERE! u guys have nothing better to do than bash me...I have made it right by the customers..and they are ALL that's important here!! Now I have other vendors taking shots at me...I made an honest mistake on where the seeds came from....I said over and over I was sorry...and more bashing came!! This thread is dead to me...I have been nice...I have been mean...I have tried to be civil....and in the end I'm in the wrong no matter what...why?? Because I decided to conduct business on a FORUM! I have made right by my customers....u say Judy is a "class act"? Look hows she's conducted herself in this matter!! Done here!! My product speaks for itself!! U can like it or not...Bakers Peppers is here to STAY!! Am I just supposed to sit here while everything I have worked so hard to build is put in jeopardy?!?! Anyone would protect their name in my situation...period!

Dale, you tainted your name all by yourself. By conducting yourself the way you did with a paying customer. Next time you get a complaint, take a different stance and I guarantee you none of this will happen. PM or not, nothing is private in a forum. If a vendor spoke to me in that manner I would never do business with them again. My profession is procurement, I deal with sales people like you all the time. I never base my purchasing decisions on price alone, customer service is by far one of the most important things I look for in a vendor. You really did this to yourself, I could not believe some of the comments you made to Denniz. DON'T BLAME OTHERS FOR YOUR OWN ACTIONS. And I am sorry but when you are buying seeds, especially at the super hot seed prices, you DON'T forget where they came from. The statement you made about Judy's seed stock, whether is was a mistake or not, is pretty serious for a business owner.

i LOVE you

I have never bought from either Judy or Dale, but I have to say this:

Judy seems to me to be justifiably angry about things. Dale does not. Judy seems to want things set straight. Dale just wants to place fault elsewhere.

I have read the things you said towards the OP, and they were absolutely unacceptable. Rude, egotistical, fat headed. You charge a premium price, one expects a premium product. You did not deliver, and that's okay. Every once in a while, thats okay, as long as you immediately, unhesitatingly rectify the situation. You did not.

I am no expert on peppers or on customer service, but I know people, and evidently you don't Dale. This is a com,unity of hobby growers, and the first thing you do is put us down? How dare you?

You are a weasel, Dale, You give yourself a bad name, and you are a blight on the growing community. You say you are finished here? I say "Thank God."
i love you TOO
 
The transaction I had with him for the Yellow Brainstrains was slightly bumpy as well. However, he did rectify my situation (3 rotten pods) by sending me a completely new SFRB filled with brains. The first box has some questionable pods in them. However, the ones I sampled that resembled Brainstrains indeed had the heat I expected to come from Brainstrains (1st pod made me throw up, and I've never thrown up from a pepper. I've eaten whole bhuts and had a 3/4 dropper full of SalsaLady's Pure Evil without ever throwing up. Not to mention heaping superhot powders on 2 out of 3 meals a day). The second box had all pods that had true brain texture. Not all had the picture perfect shape, but the texture was spot on. And again the heat was top notch. So as far as true pods go, in my experience I believe Dale sold me exactly what he claimed to sell.

Now on this situation, I am truly appalled. Dale you have alienated yourself from this community. Judy was justified in her remarks as you basically threw her under the bus in your comments to KingDenniz. Oh heck, I'm just going to shut up now...

Last thing I'll say is Dale I hope your business ends up being a success. I wish you the best and hope this whole situation is a learning experience for you.
 
I'M DONE HERE! u guys have nothing better to do than bash me...I have made it right by the customers..and they are ALL that's important here!! Now I have other vendors taking shots at me...I made an honest mistake on where the seeds came from....I said over and over I was sorry...and more bashing came!! This thread is dead to me...I have been nice...I have been mean...I have tried to be civil....and in the end I'm in the wrong no matter what...why?? Because I decided to conduct business on a FORUM! I have made right by my customers....u say Judy is a "class act"? Look hows she's conducted herself in this matter!! Done here!! My product speaks for itself!! U can like it or not...Bakers Peppers is here to STAY!!

Well anybody is a class act compared to the way you have reacted. Not to mention Judy came on here initially to clear her name because you slung shite at it not to badmouth you.

I was initially incredibly impressed by your grow setup etc and the enthusiasm you brought to the commercial side of things, but it all seems to be simply an ego trip for you now and you can't see the forest for the trees it would seem.
imagen i was away from the forum for a week or so due to school work like i always do.. i would have been slamed by his sh!t wihout knowing..... when the poor guy sent me the email saying he is sorry i am like what you talking about he said he posted bad refliction about me... i said where.... then when i seen it i was LIKE whatttttttt in god's name you thinking Dale how can you just put my name there then say you forgort....... u DONT forget where you bout 30000 seeds from... you just dont.... u dont share the Sh!t u have on ur face from ur bad service....

thank GOD i have been online and that you ALLL who knew this dude was lieing and i even posted his only order from mywebsite
 
Comp. I recall your pm to me and expected some sort of resolution similar to yours. Unfortunately. It did not happen. Shouldvet your seeds from him tomorrow or Tuesday. Lol
 
Judy. I love you And everyone on here.

thank you for sharing the chat messages between you and him.... and thank GOD i was around here when this happened ..... if not he would kept as well i got the seeds from judy go after her !!!!!!!!!!!!!

EVEN if i sell you "bad" seeds it is your responsiblity to make sure "your" customers get what they looking for not other people
 

USMC8411

Banned
Here’s a useful piece of advice: “When you’re in a hole, stop digging.”

Whether our problems are of our own making or not, whether we know exactly how to resolve them or not, the first step is to stop making things worse. Stop making excuses. Stop blaming others. Stop ignoring our strong and persistent feelings. And stop dismissing and discounting what others are telling us about their concerns, ESPECIALLY when that other person is a customer. Your business and livelihood may depend on it.
 
This is way too funny.
What did you guys expect from a seller who has used everything he could think of to get your money and as much of it as he can get,BEFORE he even has the product to sell.
Moans constantly that he needs $ for this or that to buy pots,irrigation or whatever - For a hamberger today I'll gladly pay you next...

Go through the baker pepper forum,I mean seed forum and check out the stupid high prices and times he collects your $ then says it'll be X amount of time before he even has pods to send you.

So he's selling Pepper futures... LOL


He can act all hurt etc. but the fact is,HE HAS YOUR $ in HIS bank account and that is all that matters to him.The more the merrier.

He is just another greedy grower,riding the gravy train in my opinion.

Everyone is naming any different,unstable pepper they can so they can separate a fool from their $.

Sellers have all kinds of excuses for the complaints they get, but none are growing anything out to check quality control.

You won't know if the seeds or plants are true for months.

By then they are rolling around in a bed of your cash.

They don't care about a little mud being tossed their way.
A hundred dollar bill wipes it right off.

A sucker is born every min.Especially when it comes to unstable super hots.

It takes a minimum of 8 seasons grown in isolation to even consider it as being stable most of the time.
How many of these vendors even know what they are selling or even care?
Not many in general.
A lot of these so called new strains and varieties are not ever going to be stable.

In my opinion most of the guys who bought from baker and the likes were stupid in the first place.
Prices suck along with the sellers lack of character.

I bet a lot of the buyers only had $ signs in their eyes anyway.
Thinking they too could get on the gravy train too once they grew their seeds out from the pods they bought.
 
In my opinion most of the guys who bought from baker and the likes were stupid in the first place.

Did you just insult every person that bought peppers from Bakerspeppers? Did you just call us all stupid? Because I bought from him and my peppers were great! Dude, you just need to get off the band wagon and shut up!

Wow man take a chill pill, Smoke is another well known respected member who grows for the love of chiles. Not $$$$

I personally thought people were crazy for paying his high prices! But to each their own, I wouldn't take a comment like that personally!! I think any "true" chile head would agree, it's a shame to see people taken advantage of. He's growing 1,000's of plants and still charging a premium, commercial growing usually equals lower prices.
 
I am very saddened for the most unfortunate situation he has created for himself. Last fall I donated
54 different specie types so that he may rebuild his family's business. All that I asked was for him to give back to this community and help others get started. Believe me this was not what I had in mind.

This is the one post in this whole thread that makes me feel sick over having just placed an order. That's a terrible feeling.
 
WOW. This is one unbelievable thread here. There are good lessons learned here. I have often thought about this hobby on a business aspect as well, but stuff like this shows the roadblocks that can occur. You need serious resources, land, workers and time to put it together. GREAT Customer Service too. Just having the seeds and being able to grow a plant and peppers isn't the end all be all. I'm pretty confident I may have one of the biggest collection of pepper seeds in the world. Would I ever try to start a business selling 1000s of varieties of seeds? Hell no. Full disclosure is key. Like Judy said, the members here are FAR from stupid when it comes to peppers.

Butch T sent me a box of Trinidad Scorpions (big one) back in 2007.....It's a pretty unstable variety with respect to pod shape, but there was NO doubt it was the correct variety as EVERY pod had the same heat, placental tissue, exterior, etc.

Lastly, anyone that thinks they can make a living with 60%+ of their business focused on THP, well.....no way. Think much bigger. There just aren't enough members here to generate a client base even under 100% perfect cicrumstances. The size of that nursery operation is very large...if you think the end customer is harsh here about quality control, can you imagine the sauce makers and other commercial buyers of this product?

Chris
 
OK ,OK,all the people who bought Their magic beans from "a or any" shyster are really really smart. :)



[background=rgb(255, 244, 228)]Everyone is naming any different,unstable pepper they can so they can separate a" fool from their $."[/background]

[background=rgb(255, 244, 228)]You forgot to get pissed about this part too. LOL[/background]

[background=rgb(255, 244, 228)]Too Funny...[/background]

[background=rgb(255, 244, 228)]Dam,Melissa,[/background]

[background=rgb(255, 244, 228)]The I was just going to sell the newest super duper hot here.[/background]
[background=rgb(255, 244, 228)]The Super Duper 7RocoHabapinoScorpolokia YellowRojoNegro BrainiacButchJonahsr strain.[/background]
[background=rgb(255, 244, 228)]You can pay for it now and I'll send you a seed when it pods up...[/background]
[background=rgb(255, 244, 228)]Now every one is going to think they'll get it for free.[/background]
[background=rgb(255, 244, 228)]Thanks for telling every one I don't like $$$.[/background]
[background=rgb(255, 244, 228)]I was gonna be rich I tell ya,filthy stinkin rich.[/background]
[background=rgb(255, 244, 228)]Shot that right down the drain...[/background]
 
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