Then WTF are they doing on a pepper forum asking questions? They obviously care enough to ask the hows and whys. I would say that puts them in the 20% outside the US population.
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soil Is MG soil worth it?
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Then WTF are they doing on a pepper forum asking questions? They obviously care enough to ask the hows and whys. I would say that puts them in the 20% outside the US population.
SadisticPeppers
eXtreme Business
Yes, sorry for not making that clear. The egg were that of fungal gnats specifically. I felt confident in saying they came from the MG because I went back to the local Home Depot, and by chance one other person was there for the same reason. She found fungal gnats, and used the same soil I did, which led me to believe the eggs were in the soil. She told me she stopped bothering to count after the first couple hundred fungal gnats. She also said she knew of several others who had the same issue, but unlike me, she was in for a hell of a lot more money than I was. I only bought a couple bags, and decided to pick my battle since I didn't think it was worth the amount of money I usually pay for three days' worth of soda. And up until reading this, I had no earthly idea (no pun intended) that Scotts and Miracle Gro were made by the same company. However, I'm very happy to report that I've yet to have a single sigthing of a gnat or a larva whatsoever, and I recall noticing them before the same point in time for my previous batch of plant, so they're either hibernating extremely well, or I finally have a good batch of soil
I had Alaskan Fish Fertilizer give my indoor grow fungal gnats.....every time I fed with it, they were flying around my grow box. Don't know if they were in the soil or what but when I stopped using it, I stopped getting the gnats. Although other than for seedlings, fungal gnats really don't do much to bigger plants.
i tried a bunch of cheap/big brand soils... so far kellog patio plus is what works best for me.... just throw in some more pearlite, or sand for my succulents.... although, they do give me mushrooms sometimes... but that tells me that i'm over watering... i might try promix BX soon but the price kills me... LOL... 60 a bale over here...
I'm sure there is a non-monsanto cheap brand out there on the east coast equivalent to Kellog?!?
E.B. Stone's Edna's is up there with FoxFarmsOF and its only 10$ a bag.
E.B. Stone is over there, but it is only in nurseries and if you go to that trouble why not just make your own mix?
Pearlite/Vermiculite
Peatmoss
Compost
local dirt or garden soil.
Amendments like guano, kelp, bone meal, ow what ever you wanna try.
E.B. Stone's Edna's is up there with FoxFarmsOF and its only 10$ a bag.
E.B. Stone is over there, but it is only in nurseries and if you go to that trouble why not just make your own mix?
Pearlite/Vermiculite
Peatmoss
Compost
local dirt or garden soil.
Amendments like guano, kelp, bone meal, ow what ever you wanna try.
AlabamaJack
eXtreme
unlike a lot of others, I don't have a hard on for monsanto or their products...I know....boo the shit out of me....but that's OK, I'm used to it...
the only thing bad about the MG potting mixes is that they contain time release fertilize and release the nitrogen pretty quick...that's why you get a good green flush to begin with, but the N is gone pretty quickly and you will need to fertilize also..
my question is why not make your own soil? It's not hard...and I am sure there is a recycling facility near you somewhere that you can get good compost from...just use some compost, some sand, and either peat or a standard non-fertilized potting mix...
and there is a thread that is "stickied" about soil...
.
the only thing bad about the MG potting mixes is that they contain time release fertilize and release the nitrogen pretty quick...that's why you get a good green flush to begin with, but the N is gone pretty quickly and you will need to fertilize also..
my question is why not make your own soil? It's not hard...and I am sure there is a recycling facility near you somewhere that you can get good compost from...just use some compost, some sand, and either peat or a standard non-fertilized potting mix...
and there is a thread that is "stickied" about soil...
.
Pepper-Guru
eXtreme
Make your own soil FTW! Its cheaper, easy, more controllable, safer for you the "eater", safer for the soil, safer for the plant, and far superior to any Monsanto gro medium.
These sentiments are great, and should be encouraged.
But please don't forget the new grower in an apartment with a balcony and 2 pots.
If every topic on soil is steered to "go organic", or 'make your own', it leaves those people in nowhere land.
They may want to buy 1 bag of 'something', and add a couple of things like perlite etc and nothing more complicated.
So by all means talk about the 'best' option, but don't dismiss everything else that could be used in a pinch.
That's just a general statement, doesn't apply to me but there's a lot of rah rah rah, make you own compost pile, worm farm etc that every grow thread turns into, and it may be off putting to new growers.
It's more simple in the US where people can buy FF or pro mix bx, but in other places that option isn't available so they have to start from scratch and learn by reading. Which becomes difficult when it all turns into an 'organic make your own' thread. They'd likely give up as they don;t have the resources, room or time.
But like AJ said, there is a sticky all about soil I guess.
But please don't forget the new grower in an apartment with a balcony and 2 pots.
If every topic on soil is steered to "go organic", or 'make your own', it leaves those people in nowhere land.
They may want to buy 1 bag of 'something', and add a couple of things like perlite etc and nothing more complicated.
So by all means talk about the 'best' option, but don't dismiss everything else that could be used in a pinch.
That's just a general statement, doesn't apply to me but there's a lot of rah rah rah, make you own compost pile, worm farm etc that every grow thread turns into, and it may be off putting to new growers.
It's more simple in the US where people can buy FF or pro mix bx, but in other places that option isn't available so they have to start from scratch and learn by reading. Which becomes difficult when it all turns into an 'organic make your own' thread. They'd likely give up as they don;t have the resources, room or time.
But like AJ said, there is a sticky all about soil I guess.
Bag of MG with chemical slow release fertz=$13.47 for 2.5cf
Bag of composted manure (with slow release organic nutrients)=$1.50 for .75cf
Bag of Topsoil=$1.09 for .75cf
Vermiculite=$16.97 for 2.0cf
Mix together=organic potting mix for $19.56
$5.38cf for Nasty MG VS. $5.58cf for a great, simple organic mix....Its not hard to take three bags o material and combine them.
Also, you don't even need to use vermiculite or perlite. The pro-mix bails they sell are $5.99 for 1cf which I've found to be quite lite and fluffy. You could add that instead and it would then drop your price below MG!
Also they sell Pro-Mix organic potting soil OMRI approved none the less, with sea based organic compost for 5.99cf......(they sell this at menards btw) which is very close to the MG price as well.
Using something that's no good "in a pinch" one, isn't necessary even if you live "on the second floor of an apartment building" and two, would be like a vegetarian grabbing a burger "in a pinch"....
It just really comes down to knowledge....and if you already know....then it becomes about how much do you really care.
Bag of composted manure (with slow release organic nutrients)=$1.50 for .75cf
Bag of Topsoil=$1.09 for .75cf
Vermiculite=$16.97 for 2.0cf
Mix together=organic potting mix for $19.56
$5.38cf for Nasty MG VS. $5.58cf for a great, simple organic mix....Its not hard to take three bags o material and combine them.
Also, you don't even need to use vermiculite or perlite. The pro-mix bails they sell are $5.99 for 1cf which I've found to be quite lite and fluffy. You could add that instead and it would then drop your price below MG!
Also they sell Pro-Mix organic potting soil OMRI approved none the less, with sea based organic compost for 5.99cf......(they sell this at menards btw) which is very close to the MG price as well.
Using something that's no good "in a pinch" one, isn't necessary even if you live "on the second floor of an apartment building" and two, would be like a vegetarian grabbing a burger "in a pinch"....
It just really comes down to knowledge....and if you already know....then it becomes about how much do you really care.
You kind of missed the point. I'm not saying to anyone to buy MG potting mix.
In fact like pro mix, MG isn't available here, never even heard of them before I came to this forum. And stuff like vermiculite is 4x the price. Nothing with vermiculite or perlite in the bag is even available off the shelf.
And most mixes bought at soil yards i've tried around here are rubbish too.
My point was to not close of the discussion with the exact crap you spouted, alienating a lot of people that don;t know what you are talking about or can't get what you mentions or find it crazy expensive where they are if they go by some random persons suggestion such as yours.
But no matter, like I said there's a soil thread for people to read, and as I have no access to MG soil I have no opinion on it.
My main point though illustrated by you perfectly, shut all discussion down with some post that cares little about where people live and what materials they may have access to, well done.
What I mentioned Pablo....Is not "Crap" and you, must be one of the people that cares not. The fact is, with a little research (YES, you do have to learn something new every now and then. That is how the world survives and cultures live on.....) you too can find things around WHEREVER it is that you live. Don't try and feed me some line about "I don't have that, they don't sell this, it's too hard....wha wha whaaa." The fact is, if people are coming on here to begin with, there is no reason to talk about using soils that harm the environment. With a little time and looking ANYONE can find something safe for the environment to use, without spending an arm or a leg. THAT is my point.
If Vermiculite or Perlite is too expensive DON'T USE IT. There are other amendments you can use and a lot of them are free. I don't get what your deal is....with the information out there and how easily available it is. Are you trying to say, "It's too hard, so don't tell the people living in apartments in the city to waste their time trying to find a safe way to garden" Do you think you should be excluded from finding safer ways to garden because it's harder for you?
The fact is, if you are on this forum and reading this, then you have access to all of the knowledge you need to make some bad ass soil, without a lot of hassle....if that little extra research and a little work is too much for you....then so be it. I just find it as choosing to be lazy and ignorant. Life isn't easy my friend....that doesn't give us the right to quit. For us that have done the research and have seen how much the companies that make these cheap industrialized growing mediums are crapping up the planet, we like to let everyone know how we feel about it and give them alternative ideas. I never said my suggestions were the end all be all and there is nothing else out there for you to use....get off your ass and look for it.
If Vermiculite or Perlite is too expensive DON'T USE IT. There are other amendments you can use and a lot of them are free. I don't get what your deal is....with the information out there and how easily available it is. Are you trying to say, "It's too hard, so don't tell the people living in apartments in the city to waste their time trying to find a safe way to garden" Do you think you should be excluded from finding safer ways to garden because it's harder for you?
The fact is, if you are on this forum and reading this, then you have access to all of the knowledge you need to make some bad ass soil, without a lot of hassle....if that little extra research and a little work is too much for you....then so be it. I just find it as choosing to be lazy and ignorant. Life isn't easy my friend....that doesn't give us the right to quit. For us that have done the research and have seen how much the companies that make these cheap industrialized growing mediums are crapping up the planet, we like to let everyone know how we feel about it and give them alternative ideas. I never said my suggestions were the end all be all and there is nothing else out there for you to use....get off your ass and look for it.
You know MG= MiracleGrow right? I dont mean to sound like a jerk but that is crazy to never hear about MG?
If it is true that you never heard of Miracle Grow, that is awesome! That means the millions of $ they spent to make it so you hear about them is pointless! WIN!
Yes.
You think it's economical to ship soil halfway around the world?
I have only seen the soluble ferts here, and that's only when I went looking for it. And I have never seen the tomato version either, just the general purpose version. Enough home products here that have the market.
I don't know if it's even the same in fact, the NPK is different and it was "miracle gro"
Why would you think everywhere in the world is the same as you?
This was my entire point. Everywhere is different.
Also I love to grow organically, but sometimes I can't. Most of the time I'm in rentals or away a lot. If I'm renting a house I am not going to improve the soil. So all I wish (even though I hope to move to the country and go all out big time), is people have some sensitivity and don't ram opinions down people throat, and read much as they write, and to help people instead.
You are an ass.
People either love or hate MG...I use it and get great results. I have even done some side by side comparisons with some of the other popular brands used by folks on here, and the MG is as good or better than any of them. You do need to start feeding earlier than their claims, but the time frame is on par with anything available. I use their Moisture Control or my own mix almost exclusively. Mixiing your own is the way to go. Only reason I used so much purchased soil this year is I used up all my compost prepping my in-ground beds. Mixed up some with store bought compost but didn't like the stuff. Wasn't quite done cooking so I am feeding my worm beds with that stuff or using it to top dress around my plants. Give the MG a shot, it works just fine.
Here is a pic of few Manzanos that I tested soils with from a few weeks ago...
This is about two weeks ago and a month after transplanted them...the one on the left is in MG MC and the two on the right Happy Frog...the difference is even more drastic now. The MG plant is bigger, was first to set fruit and has a ton more blooms than either of the HF plants. Love it or hate it, its not a "bad" choice and its available everywhere.
Here is a pic of few Manzanos that I tested soils with from a few weeks ago...
This is about two weeks ago and a month after transplanted them...the one on the left is in MG MC and the two on the right Happy Frog...the difference is even more drastic now. The MG plant is bigger, was first to set fruit and has a ton more blooms than either of the HF plants. Love it or hate it, its not a "bad" choice and its available everywhere.
millworkman
eXtreme
Guys seriously quite with the attacks on each other. It is stupid to attack someone because they choose to do things differently than you or do not have access to the same things as you. Not everyone lives in or near a town or city that has a garden center and most times shipping is just out of the question expensive. Not everyone cares about growing organically or how many mpgs their car gets. Its a differing opinion and just as you think anyone that doesn't care or doesn't know is ignorant and or lazy some do not care about the hippy save the planet crap. Some people like long hair and some like short, are you going to call someone out for that?
DatilDaddy
Banned
I like turtles.
The fact that Scott's (miracle grow) and other industrialized soils rammed with chemical fertilizers and produced and stored in harmful ways to the environment....is FACT...not opinion.
I'd also like to say that, MG will work as good as other soils, it just isn't good for the earth.
You might think I'm an ass, which means very little to me. I just tell it like it is. Again, if you already know that there are safer ways to grow and because it is hard to obtain, you just go with the crap. That is your choice, I just consider it lazy and ignorant.
I'd also like to say that, MG will work as good as other soils, it just isn't good for the earth.
You might think I'm an ass, which means very little to me. I just tell it like it is. Again, if you already know that there are safer ways to grow and because it is hard to obtain, you just go with the crap. That is your choice, I just consider it lazy and ignorant.