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hp22b!

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Robert Slade Russell said:
Walks up to dead horse and KICKS it
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When the dead horse represents a company I spent money and supported, and the dead horse keeps lumping people together with a derogatory term, Dead horse will be kicked repeatedly.



Here is one fact, I am getting ready to do a charge back and mail their seeds back. No need for me to complain any longer. Sorry but I am no "hater" "newbie" or anything other than a customer that wanted the information to back up the core means of my products claim.
 
semillas said:
The fees that Guiness charges for there extra services are all postet at their web site and are well known and identical for all submitters.
Nothing very expensive if you compare what HPLC and other lab works costs, if you test over years.

I know a laboratory very well and have been working with HPLC for years, same pictures can be seen at the CPI and all HPLC equipment looks the same for people not familiar with the stuff.
If the equipment is suited and the whole process is certified ??? the results should be ok.
If the process is not certified the data are not valid and must be confirmed by a certified lab

Besides this, I dont think that 1.400.000 SCU will get the record.
A record is the highest value ever measured, no need to show an average over a certain time.
A 100m runner gets the record when he once is the fastest - no need to show it several times
A pumpkin gets the record when it shows the highest weight and the farmer doesnt need to grow it several times and estimate a mean.

So Joe, I´m quite sure you will fail and will not get the record, because the morouga with his > 2.000.000 SCU couldnt be beaten.

This is the reason why we read a lot of explaining words and cannot see any numbers.

Thank You for answering all questions in detail!

Peter
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This is where we get into semantics. 2 Million maybe the hottest single pod, but if it isn't consistently 2 Million than it isn't the hottest strain. If the average most reproduceable result is 1.4 million, and that is highest average, than that is what I would buy and consider the hottest. If you have perfect soil, ideal conditions and the right nutes and can get your peppers to 2 million, that's great. I'm growing mine in the backyard out of drywall buckets, I want the easiest to reach the high overall average. That's different than a one off high SHU.

The most venomous snake in the Guinness book is listed by species, not the single tested snake. They tested a lot of snakes to compare one species to another.

It is this difference in opinion that will keep the bats to this dead horse. The mere definition of hottest. If I wanted to sell something I called the "hottest", I would want to see a statistical average that that was consistently high. Some ghost peppers at their lowest can get to barely above a hab. As a grower you don't find that disappointing? Why buy a pepper that may get 2 million, but will more likely be 700,000 when you can buy one that test results show was consistently between 1.3 and 1.5.?

He answered the question. He said he didn't know. You'll have to talk to Ed. There's your answer. Wait for Ed to chime in since that is his area. Joe is the pitchman, Ed is the guy with the numbers. So wait for Ed to answer.
 
Joe tell everybody what you pmed me........you like the fact that this information is not being released because it creates CONTROVERSY, which creates more PAGES, which creates more HITS.

Tell them how you are a MARKETING GENIUS, and how this is selling TENS OF THOUSANDS of packs of seeds for you......

Keep in mind MrJOE I still have your pms.............genius.
 
JHR said:
As a privileged reviewer of this pepper, I am talking to Ed to see what I am allowed to reveal as far as numbers go. When I know what I am allowed to say, you guys will know.
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And therein lies the problem --- why should a "Reviewer" have to see what they are "allowed to reveal" ?? shouldn't all information be released once a product goes on sale ? ( As a reviewer should you even do a review on a product that specifies conditions to the review ? ) If we were talking about a test product or a product in development then I can see not releasing some info - but once a product goes public so should the information to back up any claims being made about it --- If the info is not ready for release then the product should be held back until it is ready or the marketing shouldn't rely on that testing !
 
JDFan said:
And therein lies the problem --- why should a "Reviewer" have to see what they are "allowed to reveal" ?? shouldn't all information be released once a product goes on sale ? ( As a reviewer should you even do a review on a product that specifies conditions to the review ? ) If we were talking about a test product or a product in development then I can see not releasing some info - but once a product goes public so should the information to back up any claims being made about it --- If the info is not ready for release then the product should be held back until it is ready or the marketing shouldn't rely on that testing !
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I don't disagree, but it's the way it is. I personally think this whole thing could have been handled much better, but in all my dealings with him, Ed is first class all the way. I am confident he will sort things out.
 
armac said:
Joe tell everybody what you pmed me........you like the fact that this information is not being released because it creates CONTROVERSY, which creates more PAGES, which creates more HITS.

Tell them how you are a MARKETING GENIUS, and how this is selling TENS OF THOUSANDS of packs of seeds for you......

Keep in mind MrJOE I still have your pms.............genius.
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Maybe this whole thread should be in the marketing section since it seems Joe is thriving on the negative publicity he's creating
 
Thanks for your answers pepperjoe and SmokinJoe.

SmokinEd said:
As soon as I get a soft copy of the updated data we r sending to Guinness , I will post it here first, joe is a good man, thanks for being there brother
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Okay Joe says he will release the "updated" data, the same data he will send to Guinness.

I think that should settle it. The press release was to announce the sale, not the data. You have to buy with trust. The data will come later. Reputations have been staked. So we'll see.

If a beer company announces the sale of the highest ABV beer, their press release is certain to not include proof. It would just release the numbers. So you have to trust the source. If you do you do, if you don't you don't. And time will tell how this plays out for all involved. I know that is not the best analogy and perhaps the proof should have been released at the same time, but the fact is, it wasn't. So that's that.

It's black and white. Really there is no argument here. The best bet is to see how it unfolds and let them complete the process of releasing proof. Then the conversation can take a new turn.

Good luck to all parties.
 
JHR said:
I don't disagree, but it's the way it is. I personally think this whole thing could have been handled much better, but in all my dealings with him, Ed is first class all the way. I am confident he will sort things out.
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I don't doubt that -- the problem is usually not the grower\developer but the individuals he gets involved with that are the "business\marketing" people --- It's just a shame that Ed lets them run things the way they have and then let's them place the blame for questions back on him for not releasing the info (Like Joe did earlier in this thread) -- I'm sure it was not Ed's idea to market this thing as "The World's Hottest Pepper" as the original reason for developing this pepper was not to market and sell it this way ( At least IIRC it was about developing a pepper to help in the scientific research by developing a pepper with more extractable capsaicin) -- It's just a shame that it has gone this way but is a lesson to others of what happens once $$$ gets involved in a hobby\scientific endeavor.
 
Pepperhead said:
The most venomous snake in the Guinness book is listed by species, not the single tested snake. They tested a lot of snakes to compare one species to another.

Why buy a pepper that may get 2 million, but will more likely be 700,000 when you can buy one that test results show was consistently between 1.3 and 1.5.?
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A ghost pepper rarely hits that low though unless you are growing it like a fool. And in the same conditions it would most liekly be a lot hotter than a hab. Now treating a ghost in a way that will get the lowest, and a red savina in the way to get the htotest, you might be even, but it's rare. Heck im a first time pepper grower and my bhuts lit my entire face up. After the mouthburn subsided my facce felt sunburned badly for 30 minutes..

Habs go way in 10 total from chew - cool down and they dont make you feel like ur tongue is seared.


ALSO, snakes arent more or less venomous than each other of the same species.. The analogy is differnt because they dont need to test different snakes, but rather the LD50 of the venom in the species. Thats liek testing whats hotter, moruga/bhut capsaicin or jalapeno capsaicin. Same thing.
 
LOOK heres the deal (and i'm not saying anything that has not allready been said "dead horse"), Ed Curry AND pepperjoe are partners in this (with a couple of other people). Ed curry created this pepper, Joe has said everything he can about this subject (over and over and over "dead horse"). Ed Curry being the creator has yet to make a statment BUT he has his reasons. When Ed is ready to let out the rest of the information he will, and ALL of you will then have the answers you are lookig for.

Has anyone thought why hasn't Ed hasn't given any feed back?? I think he has his reasons. Ed created this pepper even though he is partners with Pepperjoe ED has the LAST word. And i'll bet when Ed makes his speach everyone of US will know exactly all the answers.

Alot of you have known and delt with Ed in the past, i'm sure Ed wouldnt let someone (pepperjoe) make false clames about his pepper, Do you?

Pepperjoe has stated over and over and over "dead horse" again all will be made clear in Ed Curries time not OUR time.

I would think that that people would not bash someone untill ALL the facts are put on the table and thats when Ed desides to put the on the table.

INOCENT BEFORE PROVEN GUILTY

Ok now let starting beating that damn dead horse again. (horse meat is tough and with all this beating it should be tender by now).

Thanks,
Slade
 
But even the definition of more deadly venom is debateable because there are venoms that do different things. Some snakes release more venom than others and some have a more potent venom. Everything can be debated based on semantics.

I can end at least one part of this debate. Since there are at least two camps on what defines hottest pepper we have to look at what their definition is. Clearly they are in the "overall average" camp. You can debate whether that is valid or not but they are basing their results on that standard. So if the results meet the standard they have defined than they are not being dishonest as long as they have defined and held to that standard.

Their claim is that they believe the the hottest overall pepper is based on statistical average over time. Their claim is that their pepper meets this standard. Therefore, if the pepper meets that standard than they have lived up to their obligation.

Your definition doesn't matter. Period.
 
Now, you "reviewers" have got me curious. I am assuming you tried a pepper, or a piece of a pepper and obviously, or hopefully, have compared it to a Moruga, a Butch T., or a Brain Strain for comparison. So, was the new pepper that much hotter? DId it burn longer? I can see that these guys are waiting for the right moment to submit some numbers, but do you really have to wait and ask these guys if it is alright to say, yea, that was a seriously hot pepper, or not? I have dial up so I was not able to see Mega's video in regular time, so he might have already said. It took me an hour just to see the first few minutes and I just couldn't take it any more. So guys, can you just tell us if it was the hottest pepper you have ever tried?
 
I just talked to Ed, He is sending me a pepper and when i review it (because its on a public forum"you tube") i WILL give my honest opinion i have had a butch t & brain strain and them bitch's where hot, i have a couple morugas on the way also, so i will eat the moruga one night and the reaper the next and give an honest review.
 
Just my opinion... World Hottest Pepper is the Max not the Average. The would put the currently world's hottest pepper as the TS Moruna at just above 2 million.
 
qbvbsite said:
Just my opinion... World Hottest Pepper is the Max not the Average. The would put the currently world's hottest pepper as the TS Moruna at just above 2 million.
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That is valid. That is just a different standard than what they are selling to. They don't make a claim to the max, only the average.
 
cycadjungle said:
Now, you "reviewers" have got me curious. I am assuming you tried a pepper, or a piece of a pepper and obviously, or hopefully, have compared it to a Moruga, a Butch T., or a Brain Strain for comparison. So, was the new pepper that much hotter? DId it burn longer? I can see that these guys are waiting for the right moment to submit some numbers, but do you really have to wait and ask these guys if it is alright to say, yea, that was a seriously hot pepper, or not? I have dial up so I was not able to see Mega's video in regular time, so he might have already said. It took me an hour just to see the first few minutes and I just couldn't take it any more. So guys, can you just tell us if it was the hottest pepper you have ever tried?
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I've tried a few of the reapers and its up there with the hottest I have ever had...and I have had the butch t, moruga, brain, etc, etc.I think on any given day any one of these (plus a few others) could set a record.
 
Pepperhead said:
That is valid. That is just a different standard than what they are selling to. They don't make a claim to the max, only the average.
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if that is the case then they need to add the word "average" to the claim so it should be "worlds hottest average" so people are not fooled. if they do this then we will see just how well the average is wanted as opposed to the hottest
 
Pepperhead said:
That is valid. That is just a different standard than what they are selling to. They don't make a claim to the max, only the average.
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so that's valid but you have to pay to download the info on it. And it's funny how people were complaining about the price of the reaper seeds. I for one do not beileve a pepper can get that high. Until it's proven by guiness i'm not buying this 2 million stuff from any pepper that exisits period.
 
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